[dontlaugh]

Why would Russia have done it? They want to sell gas.

The US has far stronger motive, wanting to sell LNG and benefiting from outcompeting Europe in general. Even Jeffrey Sachs suggested as much.

Sweden may have figured out the US was involved and don’t want it to be known to avoid further retaliation.

[Mikeb85]

> Why would Russia have done it? They want to sell gas.

Because they want the west to stop intervening in Ukraine more... They don't wage war to sell gas. They sell gas to wage war. Besides, they're still selling it to China and India.

> The US has far stronger motive

They really don't. Selling LNG is complicated and not really worth it. That's why most oil companies simply flared it before carbon regulations ended the practice. It's literally a byproduct of oil extraction and is nearly worthless compared to oil.

The US' #1 motivation right now is definitely stopping Russia.

You've come up with a weird justification for all this because you thing gas > geopolitics when the reality is the opposite.

[dontlaugh]

The US ruling class benefits from war in Europe in general, geopolitically as well. Intimidating rivals, pitting them against each other, taking over their territory and capital, etc.

Some of us remember the Gulf of Tonkin. It’s entirely in character for the US.

[Mikeb85]

The US ruling class benefits from stability in the world since the US economy easily out-competes everyone else's. They definitely benefit from Russia's demise since Russia is causing instability in the world. They definitely don't benefit from Europeans fighting amongst themselves.

[dontlaugh]

If they want stability, why do they keep doing the opposite? In Korea, Vietnam, Nicaragua, Iraq, Afghanistan, Serbia, Syria, Libya, etc. This time it just happens to be in Europe again.

[Mikeb85]

Literally all those countries threatened world stability by invading their neighbours or attacking the US and others directly or indirectly.

[sportslife]

The saboteurs left one line of Nordstream 2 in good working condition, able to export gas [1], which I believe could delivery around 50% of what Russia had been sending to Europe before the invasion [2]. Russia can still sell plenty of gas to Europe.

So, it could be the US with lots of time and resources messed that up. But more likely, Putin wanted to up the stakes for European countries, saying in effect "forget the sanctions; buy gas from us now, or you never will because I don't need you."

[1] https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/gazprom-nord-stream-... [2] Rough calculation: Nordstream 2 was to double gas deliveries and had 2 pipes.

[dontlaugh]

Or this was a warning from the US, to ensure obedience from the European countries.

Why is it so hard to believe many of us Europeans find it far more plausible that the US did it? Especially after all the sanctions, coups, invasions and proxy wars, now right on our doorstep.

[_kbh_]

> Why is it so hard to believe many of us Europeans find it far more plausible that the US did it? Especially after all the sanctions, coups, invasions and proxy wars, now right on our doorstep.

Because europeans don't, this is just a point pushed by Russian propagandist who are trying to sow division amongst America and Europe by conducting terrorism attacks against European infrastructure and then questioning if America did it.

I think its far more likely that Russia did this for many reasons, one was to try and force the hand of Germany to certify Nordstream 2 a win for Russia, the other was to avoid any sort of penalties that Gazprom might incur by failing to provide gas. They can now point to force majeure clauses in the contracts and escape any fines.

I think if America did this they wouldn't have left a pipeline open for Germany to use they would of hit all of them, this stinks of Russia.

[dontlaugh]

Opinion certainly varies, but it’s ridiculous to suggest I’m a Russian propagandist for disagreeing with you. I don’t have to like Russia to be more fearful of the US. Especially if you go to Eastern Europe you will encounter this view.

This “Russia did it” story is also getting more and more convoluted. The EU already sanctioned Russia and is avoiding buying their gas. Russia can simply not send gas if that’s what they want, what is the EU going to do, sanction them more?

The US didn’t already have a way to stop the flow of gas besides sanctions. Since that may not be enough over winter, further discipline has now been administered. This protects LNG profits and strengthens the US’s proxy in the area, Poland. It shouldn’t be surprising that this happened after a pipeline from Norway to Poland was completed or that a Polish diplomat thanked the US after the blasts.

[_kbh_]

> Opinion certainly varies, but it’s ridiculous to suggest I’m a Russian propagandist for disagreeing with you. I don’t have to like Russia to be more fearful of the US. Especially if you go to Eastern Europe you will encounter this view.

I never said you where a Russian propagandist I said you where using the same talking points a Russian propagandist, which is a fact.

> This “Russia did it” story is also getting more and more convoluted. The EU already sanctioned Russia and is avoiding buying their gas. Russia can simply not send gas if that’s what they want, what is the EU going to do, sanction them more?

It's been simple from day one, Russia is trying to send a message to Europe and avoid contract issues. The message is "your critical infrastructure is not safe", I wonder why we keep finding Russians with drones in Western European countries.

It's never gotten 'more complicated'.

> The US didn’t already have a way to stop the flow of gas besides sanctions. Since that may not be enough over winter, further discipline has now been administered. This protects LNG profits and strengthens the US’s proxy in the area, Poland.

Sanctions are more than enough, it's clear that European countries see Russia for the terroristic regime they are.

I don't think LNG would change in Europe there aren't enough terminals for there to be any distinct difference.

> It shouldn’t be surprising that this happened after a pipeline from Norway to Poland was completed or that a Polish diplomat thanked the US after the blasts.

I don't think this is the evidence you think it is, if anything this is evidence that the US wasn't involved. You think a US - Polish joint super secret operation was leaked by a politician?.

Why do you think that one of the Nordstream 2 pipes was left undamaged if you think it was America?. Does it not benefit America to take out every pipe?.