[Garvi]

True. He ran for office on the promise to stop the civil war in the east and enact the Minsk agreement. Instead the shelling intensified.

What's sad is up to two months ago there were UN observers in the area, publishing all their observations daily in an open public online database. If one so chooses, one can read up on the intensified shelling of the Donbass regions leading up to Russias intervention. Took me seconds to find the first time. Up to 1000 artillery explosions per day counted by international observers and published online. Go on. We're in the information age, with all that information available to us, yet no one seems to know anything concrete or where to find it. Why is that?

[trasz]

There's plenty of concrete information - like the fact that this is an artificial conflict manufactured by Russia, and it's perfectly normal to use artillery to fight enemy combatants - but you're ignoring it, because it doesn't fit your story which (I'm sure this is a pure coincidence) matches Russian propaganda. Same with alleged escalation, whereas the numbers show the exact opposite: the total number of people killed was less than those murdered by Russian nazis in Bucha alone.

[Garvi]

Can I get a source on the Russian nazi claim? It's the silliest of the claims you made and if you present a shred of evidence for it I'll reevaluate everything.

[trasz]

Oh, I’m sorry, me calling nationalistic genocide perpetrators “Nazis” was just a rhetorical figure here.

As for literal Russian Nazis: https://twitter.com/kamilkazani/status/1572972414451027970 for just one example.

[Garvi]

A thing the psyche does is make people willing to accept any information that supports their views without questioning where it came from, while at the same time dismissing any piece of information that contradicts it, also without having the mental fortitude to check. It's easier to hide and feel strong in a crows than to stand alone with your views. That's why the artificial echo chambers in social media, that all the censorship created, are so effective.

I did some light digging with the information you provided. The source is not an "independent researched", but a member of a Washington based think tank "The Woodrow Wilson Center". Literally everything he wrote in the past years was slandering Russia. Where did you think the gigantic budget of the CIA went?

The proof you provided is a telegram screenshot. You want me to make one that reads "Russian troops offering lollipops to Ukranian POWs"? Should take the average ycombinator reader minutes to whip up such a picture. You should know better.

[trasz]

So it was CIA who murdered Bucha residents, not Russians?

[Garvi]

I always found this strategy of telling your debate partner what they believe, then mocking them for it, remarkably wide spread on a technical forum, considering how juvenile and unproductive it is.

[Mikeb85]

Propaganda's a hell of a drug eh?