[customkitchen]

If we are offering absolutist opinions, I would like to offer a counterpoint.

>I've got macros to do automatic bounds checking. I've got RAII and stack traces. I've got structured concurrency, which will give the same capabilities as the Rust borrow checker if you adjust your coding style. And all this in portable C11.

You can do this all in C but it is an absolute nightmare. Every large C program grows some strange bespoke and incompatible versions of all that stuff at some point. And they're all a pain to use because none of it is idiomatic to the language. It's seriously awful. Things like the Linux kernel are the worst offenders. I will be happy when the C language finally reaches the end of its miserable, slow, agonizing death.

[ghoward]

I understand you think it's awful, but I do like it. Everyone has their preference.

[customkitchen]

You can like something and still admit that it is awful. I "liked" C for a long time before there were better options...

[ghoward]

I still disagree that it's awful.

[bravura]

The argument you are missing: Your position is bespoke and incompatible. You don't use idioms in your C code. You use idiolect. Thus, you exist in your own universe and are a party of one.

And the clue was something you might not expect...

I programmed C++ for five years, and C for over ten years before that. I don't know rust, but I followed this discussion with great interest.

One of the topics that came up several times was being able to identify who wrote what C++ code based upon their choice of language subset without using blame.

In the pro-rust arguments and C++ counter-arguments and rust counter-counter-arguments and C++ counter-counter-counter arguments in discussions above yours, I was pleasantly surprised to see that grandfather comments were rarely (never?) the same author. At least the rust and C++ arguments were made by different people sharing some sort of group mentality.

Then I hit your thread and saw the grandchild comment: "I understand you think it's awful, but I do like it. Everyone has their preference." and I was like: "Okay. I bet grandparent is also ghoward."

The simple fact that no one is chiming in to grandchild your arguments is the point that you're missing. In fact, the entire subthreads you've spawned involve basically ghoward defending ghoward's position.

It's nice when other people can take over your work. That's what we're after.

[ghoward]

It's not lost on me at all.

I prefer to finish software. [1] I get it to where it needs to be and put it in maintenance mode.

I don't accept outside contributions. [2]

I prefer to work alone to keep the scope of my software manageable and to reduce communication overhead. And to avoid working with people. People are too complicated.

I obsessively document my software. [3]

I comment all of my code. I wrote design documents and requirements lists. I write documents about the source code, its concepts, and how to understand and read it. I turn my code into something that can be studied and used far into the future.

Most programmers are not like Donald Knuth. But there are a few that are. I'm one of them.

Please let me be like that. Don't make me work like everyone else because I can't; I've tried.

I'm fine if you all want to use Rust. I even said to use it by default in my first post.

You all seem unhappy that I do not want to use Rust. I don't get why.

I'm defending my position because it appears you all think it's not acceptable. You're wrong.

[1]: https://gavinhoward.com/2019/11/finishing-software/

[2]: https://git.yzena.com/Yzena/Yc#open-source-not-open-contribu...

[3]: https://git.yzena.com/gavin/bc/src/branch/master/manuals/dev...

[gonzus]

I was going to start this reply by saying "I am not necessarily defending / supporting ghoward's position", but after I read his whole reply, I realize I am.

I enjoy writing C (more than C++); I do not find it awful. If you cannot accept that, then there is nothing I can say to change your mind. What I don't understand is this atavistic obsession that "everyone must migrate to rust now", and "C is so dangerous in can explode in your hands while you are sleeping".

Please, go forth and multiply, and use rust to your heart's content. But be more open minded to the fact that there are people who like, enjoy or even love using C. As for me, I admit I have gone from interested in rust, to neutral, to an active dislike, because this narrow-mindedness some of its proponents show.