[switch007]

One issue with the NHS is that I get the impression the information they publish that strongly respects their goals and desires perhaps to the detriment of patients sometimes.

I’ve certainly noticed in the past big differences in advice. The NHS will downplay and not suggest investigations whereas another (non UK) site does the opposite.

The NHS advice surely is carefully crafted not to cause unnecessary (from their point of view) GP visits, tests etc.

[Angostura]

I wouldn't necessarily assume that not suggesting investigations is detrimental to patient health. There is a continuing big debate in the UK medical profession about how over-investigation and over-medication/medicalising people can be a real problem in terms of patient health.

If you are seeing a disparity between UK and US in terms of advice about when something needs to be investigated, it could be that the US site is over-promoting investigations.

Keep in mind that the NHS puts a lot of work into prevention, into staying healthy without medication - it will quite often advise life-style changes, rather than popping pills - and that's for patient benefit.

[lupire]

The point is that they aren't neutral. They have a bias toward what they think is best, and they don't overcome it by acknowledging and advertising alternative views.

[switch007]

I was careful to say non-UK. (I’m also not American fwiw)

I agree with many of your points.

[Angostura]

Apologies for the US assumption.

[mclouts91]

NHS is focused on the appropriate allocation of resources to the problem. It strikes an excellent balance of doing the right work when necessary and based on probabilities. If you have evidence that the process recommended by the nhs is failing patients in statistically significant numbers I would agree with you on them not doing enough tests but frankly, I think NHS would perform very well if it was adequately resourced (it’s currently starved of necessary funding).

The NHS follows a strict set of guidelines for the identification and treatment of illnesses. They do not act like medical businesses such as hospitals whose goal is to do as much testing as they can justify to get more money from insurers.

[lupire]

That's nice, but when I'm sick, I want to get well, and I might be willing to pay for it with my money, time, or labor.

I don't want to die just because it's more cost efficient for the government to save two others.

[DanBC]

That's not the argument being made.

If you're not sick you should not be subjected to too much testing, because the risk is that you are diagnosed with a thing that will not harm you. And once you're diagnosed with it the tendency is to treat you for it. Treatment is not a neutral option, it carries risk.

Over-testing, over-diagnosis, and over-treatment all contribute to patient harm.

[switch007]

The argument was that the NHS does the exact correct amount of testing, diagnosis and treatment. That’s patently false.

The NHS regularly fails me, my friends, my family by refusing to do diagnostics while clearly sick. My GP refused to test me for Lyme disease even though I had lots of classic symptoms and had been in close contact with a deer (because he believed they’re not an issue in the area.)

I feel we’ve strayed quite far from my original point but that’s to be expected in any religious discussion.

[gadders]

Agreed. I think you would be naive to not think the NHS information factors treatment cost/managing demand into their answers as well.

[jmye]

> One issue with the NHS is that I get the impression the information they publish that strongly respects their goals and desires perhaps to the detriment of patients sometimes.

Do you have data that supports the NHS withholding or advising against necessary care that results in worse patient outcomes?

More utilization is not inherently better, and even in the systems like the NHS, everyone is incented heavily to keep patients healthy and out of the hospital system. The idea that they want you to be sicker rather than provide relatively cheap preventive care is, generally, absolute nonsense.