[nominusllc]

Is drew pursuing being a pundit more these days? He always had a certain propensity for commentary, but it was usually about projects, but now seems to be more general commentary. This reads more like a disclaimer of someone who just saw the uproar around Pine64 and said "oh crap, I recommended those. better do some intellectual damage control".

I like you drew, and I pay for your products. I make this post with a sincere face, please do the moves that got you to the dance.

[ddevault]

I write about the things which are important to me, and this is no different. FOSS belongs to all of us, and we each have a personal responsibility to make sure that the community is a positive force towards the ideals we aspire to. I take this responsibility very seriously.

I have been aware of these developments for a long time, as many PINE64 community members are among my personal friends and collaborators. I had hoped that pressure from others would be enough to bring about change, but seeing PINE64's response to Martijn's post confirmed that it's not. I'm here to do my part in keeping the pressure on PINE64 to do the right thing.

I blog often, and most of my blog posts are not critical in tone. However, critical ones tend to receive more coverage in places like HN. If you'd like to see more diverse writing from me, I encourage you to subscribe to my RSS feed.

[abnercoimbre]

> However, critical ones tend to receive more coverage in places like HN

Does that incentivize an author to be more dramatic? At least in your case, you blog without the exclusive intention of reaching front pages. But it's interesting to always note the "outrage" incentive exists.

[dewey]

He recommended it before, and now he wants to give some context to his other posts so people know he changed his opinion.

I don't see anything wrong with that. It seems to be the right thing to do. The alternative is deleting the posts so people don't get mislead by him recommending PINE64 even though he maybe wouldn't anymore at the current point in time.

[jraph]

I don't read his post as him changing his opinion on recommending Pine64, but as a request to Pine64 to fix the situation, in which he expresses his expectations. I'm rather happy he did: he is read, and I share these expectations. I want Pine64 to succeed (actually, the mobile Linux ecosystem but I think they have a major role in it and can keep having a positive influence) and I think they need to do what Drew wrote for this to happen.

I hope they'll reach out to Martjin and that they find a way to come to an understanding.

[em-bee]

unfortunately, the last thing ANY project needs in order to succeed is DRAMA!

no matter how we twist and turn, this kind of fighting is not helpful. drew may be right in what he says, but being right doesn't matter. collaboration, support and good will matter. if we want to help a project that is making mistakes, they need to be able to fix those mistakes without being denounced.

as drew says, it’s difficult to acknowledge our mistakes, and exactly because of that, we as a community need to create an environment where acknowledging mistakes is possible without embarrassment. those asked to acknowledge their mistakes need to be sure that they will be forgiven. unfortunately, with both pine64 and manjaro seemingly being pushed into a corner, i don't know if that can happen.

drew is exactly right when he describes the three outcomes, where the only successful outcome will be for pine64 to acknowledge their mistake with grace and humility.

but, this is going to be very difficult if everyone keep putting pressure in them, because for sure there will be some who will not recognize if pine64 responded with grace and humility. instead everyone else needs to deal with this problem with equal grace and humility too.

those with a stake in this situation need to get around a (virtual) table, and work this out amongst themselves, and come up with steps to move forward where everyone of them can get something positive out of it. it may be difficult, but i really wish that this is going to happen. (my son is waiting for that pinetime i ordered, and the pinephone with the external keyboard is still on my shoppinglist as my next portable server and emergency laptop, so really i am rooting for their success)

[asdajksah2123]

He's given clear recommendations.

Mobile FOSS is important. He has a position where a simple blog post by him can reach the HN front pages. It's a good thing that he's putting his opinion out there in a constructive fashion to help prevent mobile FOSS from decaying.

It would be one thing if he went all Twitter and started telling everyone to leave Pine otherwise they would be morally equivalent to Hitler.

That's not what he did. He has pointed out several alternative steps Pine can take and what he believes the outcome would be, while also pointing out a simple constructive step that he believes would help remedy not just this specific situation, but long term, perhaps irreparable, damage to mobile FOSS.

This comes across as an unambiguously good post to me.

[ocdtrekkie]

I think both Martijn and Drew have their hearts in the right place, but I strongly feel a giant blogroll of criticism posts headlining HN for three days is just going to kill the mobile FOSS ecosystem (or leave it only to Librem, which prices out most folks). And the complaint can't be separated from the fact that... people just don't like that Manjaro is the selected "default". Because a default was and is sorely needed, and of course, now that there is one, people have opinions on it.

[nominusllc]

There's no denying its entertainment value, but I agree, it does hold us back as a field of study where progress is sorely needed.

It's clear there's a lot of he-said she-said, with some truths mixed in, but what's clear is that the two sides are different paths in the road to the same destination. It's sad that we can't make it to the finish line as a team, but that's life, and that's okay.

[bayindirh]

> This reads more like a disclaimer of someone who just saw the uproar around Pine64 and said "oh crap, I recommended those. better do some intellectual damage control".

I don't think so. It all reads that "Hey, Pine64, You're ruining it. Get it together or you'll be in a worse shape".

With his prominence around certain circles, he's just making the situation tougher for Pine64, by making things even more visible, and I support that.

[georgeoliver]

I don't read it as damage control at all. He wrote a blog post on this topic 6 months ago questioning Pine64's future.