[jwitchel]

Robert Sansone, great job!

So many young prospective engineers read HN every day. Let's find comments that are encouraging or thought provoking or point readers in helpful directions Like @londons_explore did.

Bringing the beatdown is bad for everyone. Especially bad for young engineers. This kid is impressive, straight up impressive. Let's encourage him and others like him. HN shouldn't someone's supervillain origin story.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqMCYdqaFCQ&t=41s

[mortenjorck]

I think this is the right angle to take.

Unlike a lot of breathless "engineering breakthrough" stories, this piece, as well as young Mr. Sansone himself, readily acknowledge that this is a work in progress and may not pan out. Even if it doesn't, what an incredible achievement for a high-schooler – and just imagine the great contributions to the field this kid is poised to make in the coming decades.

[moffkalast]

> and just imagine the great contributions to the field this kid is poised to make in the coming decades

Well let's curb the expectations for now, it can be quite damaging for a kid be held forever to an potentially unrealistic standard just because they did something great once. I mean sure for the occasional genius it turns out fine because they live up to it, but for the rest it's a self hate and imposter syndrome on steroids.

[hosh]

I think this person has a strong intrinsic motivation to contribute innovations. He has already worked on other projects before this one. We don't have to have any expectations or setting up any extrinsic motivations or even to be cheerleaders, and instead, we can honor and respect him for who he is, and his chosen purpose. And for those with the capability and availability, act as resource if he needs it. (In the article, he says he was working without a mentor and had to figure a lot of stuff out himself).

[enduser]

I solved a major FBI case when I was 18 years old. 20 years later I'm finally stabilizing on steady beneficial contribution to society instead of pining for the next moonshot / recognition.

Thanks for being real.

[mr_gibbins]

I don't know, he's already completed 60 engineering projects and this is his 15th attempt at his 61st project. The motivation and talent is certainly there. At 17 I was pushing supermarket carts around and smoking weed with my friends. He's certainly worth keeping an eye on.

[ianai]

No expectations, just recognition of potential and effort.

[Angostura]

> the Fort Pierce, Florida-based inventor estimates he’s completed at least 60 engineering projects in his spare time. And he’s only 17 years old.

I don't think you have to worry too much about that.

[red75prime]

I hope he doesn't care what people expect of him and hold himself to the highest standard possible.

[tomthe]

Correct. Expect regression to the mean.

[zasdffaa]

"Expect" or "I want"? Comes across like you want him reduced to mediocrity.

[gumby]

... and then be excited and supportive if/when he's an outlier.

[djmips]

I don't know, there are plenty of counter examples.

[Waterluvian]

People are far more likely to become your neighbours or coworkers than they are to replace you. Gotta resist the instinct to be competitive and gatekeep.

This is wonderful work and it makes me feel bubbly about the future of engineering when young adults are _this engaged_.

[throw_m239339]

> Bringing the beatdown is bad for everyone.

It's healthy to question media narrative as the media tend to sensationalize and embellish stories for clicks or views. It's disingenuous to try to make people feel guilty about it arguing if we question that story that child will turn bad or something, in an post-truth era. Nobody is attacking that kid, just how the media cover these stories with a template.

[bryanlarsen]

I don't think this is totally on the media. The story is sufficiently weasel worded -- the motor "could" "pave the way". Anybody with any experience reads "could" as "probably not" and "pave the way" as "a tiny little step in a long process".

Most 6 year olds have figured out that "maybe" means "probably not". Many adults have forgotten that lesson.

[picture]

Hey, as someone who's participated in the same competition, you got it right on the money. It's a well known joke amongst science fair students that "could pave the way to this and that" really means its kinda useless. Some of our school's projects from two years ago worked on quantum computing but didn't achieve the goals they'd hope for so our instructor just told them to sprinkle some paved the ways in their paper

[alex_young]

Most of the major inventions of the last 2 centuries were the product of many incremental steps. The automobile, the airplane, the computer, the internet, etc.

I think it's worth celebrating even minor contributions toward a potentially world changing future personally.

[petre]

They (Tesla) now design materials with ML. So it's more optimization than innovation. I think ML combined with FEMM analysis can also be used to optimize motors. It might turn out a model that it too costly to manufacture but why not try it?

Anyway, I hope Robert Samsone uses FEMM analysis to design his motor. It will definity help him build less prototypes.

[jwitchel]

Fair enough, but context matters and there are two that matter here: (1) The subject was the tech and the engineer not biased media narratives, and (2) HN is a forum that so many people look up to. So if you want to context switch to a discussion about the media (a worthy subject BTW) post a new thread; let's not do it on a thread that is spotlighting interesting tech from a promising engineer.

[slingnow]

I would much rather live in a world where people question biased media narratives and we risk hurting someone's feelings than the other way around. If this kid can't handle a little bit of criticism, he won't be long for the engineering discipline.

[psd1]

That's a false dichotomy

> If this kid can't handle a little bit of criticism

I do expect adults - over 25 - to take the rough with the smooth. But children are not adults.

I think you're assuming your own competence at pedagogy. I would want to shield children from you until they've developed the resilience you demand from them.

Also, the emotional tone - sheesh

[jwitchel]

+1 And to pile on a bit here... part of learning to be a good engineer is learning how to give good constructive feedback. If you are creating real risk of truly hurting someone with your feedback (in a PR or a code review for example) then it's you who are at fault for tone deafness not them for being thin skinned.

Giving and getting feedback is hard. It's a skill and it doesn't come easily to most. Sometimes hurting someone's feelings is inevitable, but starting from a place of "toughen up buttercup" is really self-serving and counterproductive.

There is always someone better than you, and always someone worse. Always someone who knows something you don't, and always someone who can learn from you.

[MichaelCollins]

> But children are not adults.

He's 17 years old, so he's not a full adult. But classing him as a child, in the same category as 6 year olds, seems further from the truth than calling him an adult. 17 years old is old enough to join the army, today, in numerous developed first world nations like New Zealand, Norway, and with parental consent, Germany and America.

[jwitchel]

It's not a binary choice. We can and should have both. We can also provide constructive feedback and at times criticism both without risking hurting their feelings. Again, the point is time and place.

[dieselgate]

Don’t know about this one, when it comes to someone who is younger than 18 for this context I’d error on the side of “if you don’t have anything nice to say don’t say anything”. If it’s Sharktank or something that’s a bit different

[tiahura]

Being a curmudgeon isn't a virtue.

[RHSeeger]

Given the sheer number of headlines like "<This invention> will change the face of <this well known thing>" that really boil down to "<This idea, which isn't even new> is interesting to think about, but won't really have any impact on <this well known thing>"... it really doesn't make one ill-tempered to bring up for discussion whether the current article is one of those.

It might not be one of those, and it's not fair to assume it _is_ one of those... but discussing whether it is or not isn't rude/mean, and probably _should_ be standard practice.

[irthomasthomas]

A curmudgeon is what a cockeyed optimist calls a realist.

[cheschire]

Will the kid understand that's everyone's intent, I wonder?

[Silverback_VII]

He surely will have to understand that to be exceptional creates a lot of headwind (certainly in his own field).

"The higher we soar the smaller we appear to those who cannot fly."

[justsocrateasin]

I had a hunch this would link me to The Incredibles. Great reference and I totally agree with the sentiment.