[em-bee]

this is probably related to the effect of different ways we perceive love. see the five love languages. we need to talk to our partners about that and try things to find out what makes them feel our love. and also tell them how we receive them.

[sneak]

The love languages concept is pseudoscience, just like the MBTI.

[zarzavat]

I wouldn't say it's pseudoscience, it's not science at all. It's just a list of five different things which different people may value more or less.

Understanding your partner's values may not be scientific, but it is a good idea.

[mikepurvis]

I think it's well understood at this point that it's pretty much about giving people some shared language to talk about needs in a relationship. However, even with that, there's some contention— "words of affirmation" specifically seems to get a lot of heat.

Like, yes it's valuable to be aware of your partner and use those observations to uplift them, but it can also swing into some pretty unhealthy territory too ("when you raised that issue with me, I felt criticized, and then my words of affirmation need wasn't met any more; if you love me, you need to demonstrate that by not raising things with me") or even becoming a demand for unrealistic, toxic positivity ("I need you to be positive about/to me no matter what; I will be dependent on you for my emotional well-being, and if you're ever not positive to me, I'll become sullen and depressed and it will be your fault").

So yeah, love languages can be helpful as a starting point, but you still need guardrails in place (for example, a professional counselor) to make sure it doesn't get used in a manipulative, unhealthy, or unfair way.

[morelisp]

If you say stuff like "people communicate and reciprocate love differently", then it's neither science nor pseudoscience.

If you say stuff like "these are the five specific love languages and everyone has two", that's either science or pseudoscience, and I'll give you two guesses how rigorously tested the hypothesis is.

Can't write a best-seller framed like the first one, though! People eat scientism up.

[em-bee]

just like MBTI this is not an absolute where these types define your personality and predict your behavior that you can't escape. that of course is nonsense. but both are useful to get a better understanding about yourself, your partner and your relationship.

talking about these things with your partner works, and that helps to improve your relationship. i can confirm that from my personal experience.

[yunohn]

> love languages concept is pseudoscience

Love is not a science.

Disclaimer: This is not an endorsement of “love languages”.

[yieldcrv]

love languages are bullshit, but it is useful to know if someone doesn't like physical touch

but don't worry, I play along with that, myers briggs, astrology, angel numbers, ambiguous western spirituality, and I'm a great listener (because I'm too dumbfounded to know what to say and I don't mind being an enabler, for sex)

unlike the others, its only the myers briggs people that take their belief system seriously, since it was probably used on their job at the teambuilding retreat and in academia, but increasingly the love language people have a blind spot for it too

everyone else can just laugh about their consequence-free religions

[em-bee]

it is possible to take these things to seriously. i didn't read the five love languages book end to end. it was enough for me to know that there are different ways to express love and that we have different preferences in what ways we notice love from others. that is the core that matters here, and is what helped me understand our relationship better.

same for MBTI. i don't know what specific MBTI type i am supposed to be, and i don't really care, but understanding the different aspects that MBTI is based on does help me understand myself better and let's me explain for example why i enjoy company some times and not at other times.

there used to be a time when astrology and astronomy where the same thing. astrology is pure nonsense, but the astronomy it is based on is not. in the same way MBTI may be nonsense, but the aspects it is based on probably are not.

to be a great listener it takes a few things, to listen, to give positive feedback and to help the other person work out what they want to say. listening itself makes up the biggest part. pretending to be a great listener may work in the short term, but someone will eventually figure out that you don't actually care about what they say.

[yieldcrv]

you might be pleased then to know that the same introspective possibilities are available in astrology, and many people get that from it. It goes much deeper than a procedurally generated daily horoscope and judging someone for the month they were born in.

Guess I listen better than you might have gathered from what I wrote, I’m pretty quick on the improv and with astrology pretty much all you have to do is not call it bullshit and people are surprised and enamored that you didnt! Because they expect you (or guys) to.

regarding love languages, I’m glad you got something out of it. I gather that most people just take an online quiz or just read the categories and choose one or three. The quiz being on the website of the book author if I recall correctly.

[em-bee]

fair point on judging your listening skills. what put me off was that you gave the impression of listening with an ulterior motive. it sounded like you are not listening because you truly care about their well being but only because it enables you to get closer to them. that feels like taking advantage of their vulnerability

everything can be used as a starting point for introspection. as long as the focus is on the introspection, that is fine, but at least things like extrovert and introvert are based on observable human behavior, but ideas drawn from astrology are divination that is completely unrelated to human qualities or experiences. anyone trying to claim more than that is either deluded or a fraud. people taking astrology seriously are a red flag for me. i would not want them as friends even, let alone a partner.

or in other words i am open to be proven wrong when it comes to character types. if someone can come up with a better explanation that completely eliminates those types, i'll be interested. but i don't for my life believe that there is any repeatable observable benefit from applying astrology, that can not also be explained as pure coincidence.

[yieldcrv]

> it sounded like you are not listening because you truly care about their well being but only because it enables you to get closer to them

> people taking astrology seriously are a red flag for me. i would not want them as friends even, let alone a partner.

The only problem with me going along with these belief systems, but astrology in particular, is that its usually the tip of the iceberg of other forms of susceptibility and unsubstantiated magic, and also damage.

but if I was choosing between the MBTI person that takes themselves seriously because an MBA and their companies’ executive uses it, and the carefree astrology person that expects to be criticized, I would chose the astrology person.

so its a little column A, a little column B

people are damaged and susceptible, they replace one religion with another to “find themselves”

I’m just there