[_9xrb]

While American and European sunbathers tend to seek the perfect tan, many Indian and East Asian women avoid it at all costs, through sunscreen and a whole bevy of skin-lightening products:

https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-18268914

https://www.sixthtone.com/news/1005927/chinas-quest-for-fair...

Such standards of beauty are quite old and largely predate Western colonialism. My impression is that they were often linked to caste or class, where higher-class people spent more time indoors while lower-class workers spent more time out in the sun.

This cultural difference is the source of much amusement for the Indian spouse of my European coworker. When they vacation in Europe all the ladies on the beach want to tan, and when they visit India it’s the other way around.

[southerntofu]

> My impression is that they were often linked to caste or class, where higher-class people spent more time indoors while lower-class workers spent more time out in the sun.

I'm no expert on the topic, but i heard people refer to this sort of social symbol and discrimination as "colorism".

For anecdote, in France, "sang bleu" (blue blood) used to refer to the nobles and higher classes, as they didn't work the fields, and their thin and pale skin let see through the blue-looking veins. From what i hear, it appears before the revolution this biological distinction was formally racialized: the higher classes with their never-sighted "blue blood" was another "race" as the lower peoples whose spilled blood we could confirm was red.

[samstave]

Yep,

In many caste-esque societies, having a darker tone is a sign of having to work outside, thus of lower class.

This happens a lot in the Philippines, for example. With a ton of skin lightening products.

[rrrrrrrrrrrryan]

Being chubby and pale was desirable when the poor had to toil away outside and didn't have enough food to eat.

Being thin and tan is desirable today when the poor have to toil away in offices and don't have enough free time to go to the gym or take vacations in warm places.

[derefr]

Being tan is desirable for the upper class, because they're trying to avoid being seen as middle class "toiling away in offices", and don't particularly care about being confused for lower class.

Being pale is still desirable for the middle class themselves, though, as they're trying to avoid being seen as lower class (tradespeople, farmers, etc).

Also, thinness is actually a middle-class obsession, because it's the lower class who "don't have enough free time to go to the gym or take vacations in warm places." The upper class don't care what their bodies look like, as they all know that they and everyone else in the upper class can afford to "throw money at the problem" (plastic surgery et al), and so how healthy you look is no longer a good signal for how healthy you actually are. (Instead, they tend to judge your genetic fitness — when they care about that sort of thing — by the health of your lineage, going back several generations. Which is one reason royals/nobles make a big deal of keeping track of that.)

[samstave]

>".... farmers..."

[Dystopian Aside]: I have been saying for a very long time (rightly/wrongly), but always been laughed at; "In the future, the most valuable people will be farmers"

I was laughed at.

However, look where we are headed. Right now, today ; BGates is not only one of the most famous and richest people on the oblate spheroid, he is also the richest "farmer"[0] in the world.

The "farmer" ([0]:pharm-er) who masters lab-grown civilization-supporting-scale sustenance production will be the richest in the galaxy.

Ever try to corner the galactic wheat production in Trade Wars on BBSs in the 1980s? Yeah - we are at stage zero of seeing that in action, and it wont be pretty.

[numpad0]

Chubby and tan signifies strength and wealth. Thin and pale yet rich is a contradiction, adds mystique and suggests power.

[samstave]

Ha You physically fit, hardy to the elements, thin, muscular, used to hardship, leathered and hardened skin, emotions, grit and resentment who is only capable of using farm implements, what power do you have against me and my court of beautifully adorned elite, who weild the master-craft blades of our ancestors!? HA

'Farmer-class': Well, we have awareness, darkness, and an array of farming tools as weapons, such as Kusari Gama (sickle), nun-chuck (rice thrashers), the modern police baton is a farmers implement...

Also, we know how to fight in close quarters, such as your Rice Palace, and as such we have short, straight, nible blades and Iai KPIs show that our blades are superior in cramp enclosures, as opposed to your blades, which the curve is to assist in the blade length for the cut as you pull, however, in close quarters, your large exaggerated movements are a detriment....

Also, We know that our blade is a tool thus, we will flick dirt at you with it, because you see your sword as an extension of your soul, and will not let it touch earth.