[portpecos]

I also need clarification on what he means by Modi bypassing parliament to pass his own bills. That’s not how a parliamentary system works. Imagine Tony Blair bypassing the House of Lords and the House of Commons to pass his own bill. Or Obama bypassing the Senate and House of Representatives to pass his own bill. It’s a very strange claim to me.

[valarauko]

Not GGP, but I assume they mean that bills were passed through parliament without any real debate or amendments, since the governing party holds a super majority.

[portpecos]

The UK has done the same when having a party majority in the House of Lords and House of Commons.

In the US things are different. Even if there is a party majority in the Senate and House, the Filibuster is powerful enough to table the party majority’s bills.

[valarauko]

Unfortunately, the way things proceed in India tend to be more crass - where the opposition often tries to physically prevent the tabling of controversial bills. We've had occasions where members grabbed papers off the Speaker's desk, and members routinely try to block proceedings by entering the well of the House and sloganeering. This leads to the Speaker adjourning the session and/or the opposition staging a walkout during the actual vote. It's not uncommon to see parliamentary sessions with only the treasury benches full for the vote.

[portpecos]

Maybe India takes inspiration from her colonizers?

"How did the British Parliament become a place where the person speaking is constantly interrupted while the US Congress is one where the audience is quiet?"

Answer: "It didn’t become such a place, it always was such a place. It started life as a collection of people sent by various towns to meet the King to petition him for some action or other. It was a totally formless group of individuals admitted to the King’s larger meeting hall when and if the King permitted. As such they would shout over each other in the attempt to get the King’s attention. Over the centuries it became more formalised and more structured, and a modicum of order imposed. But it has always had the character of a rowdy everybody against everybody discussion rather than an academic debate.

Famous Parliamentarians, particularly Winston Churchill, have enjoyed it being so and encouraged it. The width of the gangway is still two swords lengths, so they cannot engage swords across it, and the cloak rooms outside still have ribbons intended for you to hang your sword before entering the chamber. Parliament values its traditions of being a barely orderly town meeting."

I don't know how accurate that answer is, but it was the top comment in quora. Other sites show similar answers.

[valarauko]

Makes sense that it's the system we inherited. For what it's worth, I'd rather have my representatives voice dissent loudly rather than compliance. I wish that dissent was channelled productively rather than show for the TV cameras, but alas, that's what we've got. I do think it's a superior system to the two party US system, especially for such a large and diverse nation like India. It desperately needs reform, though.

[HaloZero]

I thought Modi's party only had a super majority in the lower house though, don't they need both houses?

[valarauko]

The party holds a simple majority (~ 55%) in the Lower House, while the alliance holds a near super majority (~ 63%) - the Indian system holds a super majority at 2/3rds of each house present and voting, not the total membership of the house.

The alliance does not hold the upper house, though they have a near simple majority.

[portpecos]

1984: Rajiv Gandhi’s Congress Party got a super majority (77%)

1980: Indira Gandhi’s Congress Party got a super majority (65%)

1977: Indira Gandhi's Congress Party got a majority (56%)

1971: Indira Gandhi's Congress Party got a super majority (68%)

1967: Indira Gandhi's Congress Party got a majority (55%)

1962: Nehru's Congress Party at 73%

1957: Nehru's Congress Party at 75%

1952: Nehru's Congress Party at 74%

If the complaint is, "Supermajorities aren't a Democracy", then it must be agreed upon that India hasn't been been a Democracy under the Congress Party for 32 years out of the 75 years of independence.

[valarauko]

> If the complaint is, "Supermajorities aren't a Democracy"

Is anybody actually saying that? For what its worth, I do think super majorities are corrosive long term for the multiparty Westminster style parliamentary systems. There is little incentive for compromise building or genuine debate on bills. It might even work if political parties had visible internal debate and discussion, and we can largely agree that this is not a thing in Indian political parties.

[dhruval]

The original claim was that the senate was bypassed (non-democratic).

A majority in the Senate is democratic if democratically elected etc.

Whereas increasing the power of the executive as is the trend in the USA by bypassing the house / Senate is corrosive to democracy in my view.

[neeleshs]

>>Also Modi has the distinction of passing maximum bills without debate and bypassing the state senate altogether

I think this comment can be interpreted that way to some extent. Reads like one person has the power to bypass an entire legislative house. That's not the reality though.

I do agree with you that having supermajority for a long time is not a good thing. Unfortunately for India, that's how it has been historically (Congress for long periods of time and now it looks like BJP)

[webmobdev]

The three routes Mr. Modi government has chosen to bypass parliamentary scrutiny and oversight on the law it creates are by bypassing parliamentary committee or passing them through ordinances or as money bill:

- Explainer: How the government makes new laws less robust by bypassing parliamentary panels: https://scroll.in/article/932186/explainer-how-the-governmen...

- How India’s Govt Is Setting In Place A New Structure For A Dysfunctional Parliament: https://article-14.com/post/how-india-s-govt-is-setting-in-p...

- Explained Ideas: How the Modi govt has been bypassing Parliament: https://indianexpress.com/article/explained/how-modi-governm...

- Manmohan Singh raps Modi govt for misuse of 'money bill' provisions - https://www.business-standard.com/article/current-affairs/ma...

- Aadhaar Act as Money Bill: Why the Lok Sabha isn't Immune from Judicial Review - https://thewire.in/law/identity-of-the-aadhaar-act-supreme-c...

- Jairam Ramesh moves Supreme Court against treating Aadhaar bill as money bill - https://www.thehindu.com/news/national/jairam-ramesh-moves-s...

- A 7-judge bench will decide whether amendments to the PMLA could have been made through the Money Bill route - https://www.indiatoday.in/law/story/supreme-court-pmla-verdi...