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by rogers12 1422 days ago
what's proper infection control?
3 comments

I just learned that an acquaintance of mine flew on a plane knowing they had tested positive for covid. Or my partner's family just had a family get-together (she didn't go) while one her family members had covid.

In the former case, policy changes to reduce likelihood of people flying with covid (temp checks, affidavits, allowing removal of obviously ill passengers), and to increase ventilation and filtration on planes, and perhaps to even bring back masks or at the very least encourage or incentivize them in times of high transmission.

I don't know that we can do much about the latter case other than better public health education and perhaps PSAs.

We had to cancel a lot of summer vacation plans as our kid wasn't eligible to get vaccinated (until very recently) and they abruptly cancelled the in flight mask mandate. The scenario you describe is exactly why we wear N95 in the airport and on planes even today. Case counts are going to need to come way down before the masks go away.
People should stay home when they are ill and isolate, with any transmissible illness.

But in 99.999% of cases, non-airtight masks do not work at all. Not even a little bit.

The number of significant digits you provided suggests you're extremely confident of this. Can you provide a source? For instance, there's this study[1] that suggests surgical masks are as effective as n95 masks.

[1] https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6...

The Lancet also said that HCQ were dangerous and caused extra fatalities in COVID patients. They then retracted that because the data there were basing that on was completely made up. https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6...

The journals are unreliable on this and many other topics. Objective data suggests that mandatory masking has no effect on transmission.

>The journals are unreliable on this and many other topics. Objective data suggests that mandatory masking has no effect on transmission.

1. It's ironic how much you denounce the value of journals and extol the value of "objective data", yet you have not attached any "objective data" (in any meaningful sense) with your original comment, and have dodged follow up requests for sources.

2. You're moving the goalposts from masks "do not work at all" to "mandatory masking has no effect".

The Lancet knowingly lied about HCQ. Therefore I don't trust them.

Anything less than an airtight full aerosol filtration respirator will not stop aerosols infected with SARS-CoV-2 from leaving and being inhaled by people. Fact. The latest CDC data suggests that "medical masks are better than cloth masks" but never attempt to identify a difference between a cloth mask and nothing.

This article outlines a paywalled paper suggesting masks don't work at all. https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2020/04/data-do-...

The incidence of infection between areas that are fully mask-mandated can't be proven to differ significantly from areas that had no mask mandate due to many other factors https://www.cebm.net/covid-19/masking-lack-of-evidence-with-....

I don't trust the establishment because they were wrong about everything. Fauci lied about masks, then lied about lying about masks, then lied about HCQ, then about IVM and other treatments. The NIH has provided 0 guidance on treating COVID other than vaccines. They did eventually do a study on HCQ to "disprove" it's effectiveness but started the dose at 1200mg/day! Nearly lethal. This of course started on patients that were too far advanced in disease and also had co-morbidities. It was a sham and borderline homicidal. All to protect the emergency use authorization for vaccines and Remdesivir.

A course of HCQ: $10. A course of Remdesivir: $3000. Which is a more fiscally responsible opportunity for a for-profit industry that controls the NIH and FDA?

The NIH staffers including Fauci (and of course the expert who is not an expert: Bill Gates) stand to make a lot of money on vaccines from Moderna and Pfizer.

Fauci also lied about the NIh funding gain of function research in the Wuhan lab under oath to Congress. https://www.outkick.com/nih-admits-fauci-lied-about-gain-of-...

Historically the entire medical industrial complex and APA lied about the "chemical imbalance" theory for depression for decades while making billions of dollars selling SSRIs and misleading the population for profit: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41380-022-01661-0

It is my opinion that these establishment organizations have 0 credibility anymore and I would never trust anything put forth by them at face value.

2. If masks don't prevent transmission, and mandates are intended to prevent transmission then mandates don't work. Aristotelian logic.

You’d have to align incentives to change behavior. Right now, people go to work sick because they have bills to pay. They board flights sick because it’s expensive and inconvenient to quarantine away from home.
Masking in public spaces, where practical

WFH as standard (unless the job requires presence)

Illegal for employees to attend work while sick, with fines etc for employers, much like fire regs. Perhaps this can be a strict liability offence.

Capacity limits on public spaces according to ventilation standard - no ventilation, no public.

Testing everywhere for all the things.

...

You forgot federal sick leave. Governor Baker cost me a week's pay when I got it this spring and had to quarantine for a week.
The Federal Government can't be expected to pay/mandate payment for every citizen's inconvenience and health problem.

You lost a week's pay because you couldn't work because you were ill. Not because some politician was mean and didn't pay you or tell your boss to pay you.

If they mandate something they need to provide the support. If they cannot afford it they shouldn't pass on those costs to citizens.