[tested23]

There are probably a million different causes for depression and im convinced for all but the most extreme cases that usage of anti depressants is a mistake.

I think viewing depression as a disease instead of a symptom is a mistake. So many people eat food completely devoid of nutrition, stay indoors all day, have erratic sleep schedules, drink absurd amounts of alcohol and smoke weed all day. Why are we giving these people antidepressants when what they need is to go outside and walk and to take a multivitamin?

[quacked]

Completely agree with you, although I think that "going outside and taking a multivitamin" is an inadequate substitute for "live inside a prosperous, functional human-shaped society".

[_yoqn]

It's not society. It actually starts with the individual. In order to have nay kind of decent society, each individual needs to recognize that they are responsible for themselves and their own society. Going outside, exercising and consuming nourishing foods are the literal starting place. Then seek to find things you like doing and become competent in them. Find a good wife or husband. Don't cheat on them. Don't take alcohol to excess, etc. etc.

The point is, you cant start from the outside and work your way down the the individual. It starts with the person.

[quacked]

I completely disagree with that. If you are a westerner with a 50th percentile mind and follow every rule set up for you, you end up on a console for 8-10 hours per day, struggling with bills and health insurance and watching the land and culture around you be slowly eroded into a formless mass of concrete and advertisements.

"Depression" is a natural response to living an alienating modern lifestyle. The people who can appropriately "deal" with it (like myself) all have something extra going for then, like deep family structures or unusual minds.

[DontchaKnowit]

While this is true in terms of finding a solution to depression, I do think that the societal norms of our society are extremely conducive to these sort of depressive behaviors. E.g. many societies are setup to make these kinds of behaviors (self isolation, dopamine seeking hedonic treadmill type behavior, etc) very difficult to engage in without being chastised

[_yoqn]

I see your point, and my argument supports it. Who creates "societal norms" other than the individuals that make up society? It starts with individual action to reverse the dwindling spiral.

[DontchaKnowit]

Sure. It is certainly a "collective action" type problem.