[maest]

I'm sure the YT PMs have proof that this improves engagement.

On a similar note, I've started noticing the third video in the "related videos" section on the right-hand sidebar is usually a new video with _extremely_ clickbait and inflammatory titles - sometimes with little connection to the topics I usually watch.

They're extremely distracting so I've set up a uBlock filter for these: `www.youtube.com##ytd-compact-video-renderer.ytd-item-section-renderer.style-scope:nth-of-type(3)`

This doesn't work 100% of the time, but it's good enough. (in particular, it fails if what I'm watching is a trailer video which makes the 2nd recommendation in the sidebar be a movie recommendation which doesn't fit this rule; as a result it blocks the 4th entry in the list, but oh well)

[TuringNYC]

>> I'm sure the YT PMs have proof that this improves engagement.

...and it probably does in the short term, as you just try to engage more with the software trying ever harder to find what you want. But probably also kills engagement in the long term. Personal experience with this: Facebook post-2020 vs Facebook pre-2015.

Facebook pre-2015 was so magical as I was finally reconnecting with long-lost school friends and childhood neighbors we long lost touch with (pre-email friends.)

Facebook post-2020 is me engaging desperately to see something other than the same 10 repeated posts per day...knowing full well that the magic is still in there, just not visible by default. And then one day I just stopped checking.

[rsch]

Yes there was this one day where you open Facebook and literally every other post is Sponsored. And this Reels thing with some random videos from whatever.

But yeah anyway, do you still know people who actually post on Facebook?

[trentgreene]

No, but I kind of miss it. My Facebook years were roughly 2008-2011, and they were magical. You’d talk with your friends in a fun, async, low stress manner, look at funny posts, hear about shitty but fun local shows, post literally random bs you were thinking. And people you know would really engage, Unironically and in good faith. I don’t remember a lot of clout farming in those days (MySpace had a decent amount, so I’m sure it existed).

I don’t think any other social media came close to how purely good Facebook was in its golden years. I’d love for someone to write a book on how it declined.

[ithinkso]

> I'm sure the YT PMs have proof that this improves engagement.

I sometimes wonder if the opposite is true - that the PMs can convince the upper managment that users are staying on the website longer with all those stupid as fuck shit changes, but in reality they are there longer because it's increasingly more difficult to find anything you are looking for

Sort of 'When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure'

[pgreenwood]

Yes, like the way modern shopping centres seem to be designed to disorient.

[nine_k]

Not to disorient, but to force you travel past most isles, increasing the chance of impulse buys.

[eurasiantiger]

No, they are literally designed so it is difficult to tell where you are and which ways lead to exits, because it increases the amount of impulsive purchases.

This mind trick is called the Gruen transfer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gruen_transfer

[visarga]

I thought they were just incompetent, but I think you're right.

[pjbeam]

Successfully being a PM and successfully managing a product are often at odds with each other. I've seen few do it well. Not really picking on PMs either, as both an SDE and now an EM I deal with similar tensions. Gotta love corpo life.

[raghavbali]

Could you elaborate that a bit more on this? I am on SDE side and keen on understanding the PM motivations as well

[MWil]

Reminds me of that scene from The Office (US) where Phyllis is calling 411 to inquire about anti-gravity machines and they ask if she'll settle for...

well just watch... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZG1NeA3WoKc

[BarryMilo]

She was so perfectly cast as Sadness. Hope that actress is actually happy but she does depressed so well!

[polytely]

She was really good in The OA

[3np]

Do you notice if being signed in affects this? Just set out to try it (not signed in) from the first video that came up when I searched "Linux" and kept clicking the third video wondering how long until I get to Hitler.

Never got there. After a brief detour in some Greek channels I can't comment on, I ended up in a seemingly endless loop of mindfully woke TEDx talks (as in, no political or inflammatory stuff, just different variations of "how to live your life to the fullest", "this is how your brain works", "the secret to to happiness/productivity/communication...", etc.

[maest]

Good point re being signed in.

Logged in:

Watching RedLetterMedia video, get recommended a clickbaity video about comic books: https://postimg.cc/QVkc7QwQ

Watching Colombo snippets, get recommended some celeb Net Worth trashy video: https://postimg.cc/grRNTL5j

Climate Town links to some unrelated video about Orlando amusement parks: https://postimg.cc/jW0zNMxh

These are way milder than I remember, btw.

Logged out, no weird recommendations:

https://postimg.cc/gnLXD3Bt

https://postimg.cc/DJDfJMFv

So yeah, logged out doesn't have that 3rd obnoxious video, which is kind of interesting.

[behnamoh]

F*k such PMs, seriously. With all the anti-pattern behavior I see from different companies, these PMs shouldn't stay in their job for more than a day. Let a senior engineer with domain expertise take the position.

[sph]

As if the company-wide engagement focus doesn't come from the very top.

[michaelcampbell]

> with _extremely_ clickbait and inflammatory titles

A number of YT'ers I follow have mentioned this is basically required now for any sort of rankings.

[zeruch]

I wonder if blocking whole channels counts as 'engagement'

[ipaddr]

Until this changes to the 4th or 2nd