[quarantaseih]

"they couldn’t manage their currencies "

Typical Northern Protestant bigotry. As if Italians and Greeks don't have economics courses in college.

Italians, Greeks, etc would purposely devalue their currencies to effectively lower wages (which are sticky) wrt to international markets, making their exports competitive while manufactured imports more expensive. The French created the CFA (under the bayonet) to have a larger economic mass to play with (the most egregious post WW2 colonial abuse by Europe).

of course this policy results in (very well managed) inflation which results in the middle class saving through real estate, hence these countries' high rates of home ownership (Greece in particular).

So the single market (ie no protective tariffs) and a single currency are poison to Southern Europe's industry so why should the agree to it? They agreed under the condition that Germany's industrial appetites wouldn't be rapacious. Which was a great plan, after all when has Germany ever tried to swallow its neighbors? /sarcasm

[mmarq]

> Typical Northern Protestant bigotry. As if Italians and Greeks don't have economics courses in college.

For your information I am Italian, I won’t reply to the rest of your fantasy, but I have to say that I’m very surprised that this CFA thing is popular also outside Italian economic conspiracy websites.

> They agreed under the condition that Germany's industrial appetites wouldn't be rapacious.

So you are saying that when Italy joined the euro, they asked the Germans to slow down research and development and to artificially reduce the productivity of its industry? Or does “rapacious” mean that the Germans send assassins to kill good Italian managers? Are you implying that Italians are inherently less productive than Germans?

[quarantaseih]

"For your information I am Italian"

So was I until I grew out of it. What's your point?

"Are you implying that Italians are inherently less productive than Germans?"

... yes? The data is very clear about that including significantly less cars made per employee hour in FIAT's Napoli plant than in, say, Poland.

I didnt venture an explanation as to why Neapolitans make less cars, nor do I care. The role of Rome, or any government, is to represent the interest of its citizens.

If Napoli makes less cars because there's less capital invested or because they all get sick during the world cup is of secondary concern to me. My primary concern is that the internal market ensures my citizens are employed in a dignified labor (and not that story of a woman offered 200euros/month to work 6 days a week as a cashier)

"but I have to say that I’m very surprised that this CFA thing is popular also outside Italian economic conspiracy websites."

The CFA is not a conspiracy theory, ask Congo (or Gaddafi. Or do a HN search in the bottom of this page), and you'll find websites in all languages talking about it. Especially French, but Ive read websites in Spanish, and in English.

The only language I haven't read about the CFA is in Italian, but the Italian internet is... dull.

"Or does “rapacious” mean that the Germans send assassins to kill good Italian managers?"

I think German appetites are well known in Europe going back a millennia. Im hardly the first to note that the Germans have, through the EU, accomplished exactly what they've wanted what they've failed to do in a thousand years of warring.

"So you are saying that when Italy joined the euro, they asked...."

Read my original comment. I clearly state that I dont know if it was in the treaties or not, however it is a common complaint that there supposedly was an agreement. I then explained why that agreement would make sense, since no rational actor could possibly enter a single market without some safeguards.

[mmarq]

> So was I until I grew out of it. What's your point?

That I’m not Nordic nor Protestant.

> ... yes? The data is very clear about that including significantly less cars made per employee hour in FIAT's Napoli plant than in, say, Poland.

So, is it a racial thing? The Italian is inherently less productive because he doesn’t have the German spirit?

> The CFA is not a conspiracy theory, ask Congo (or Gaddafi.

I’m not sure Gaddafi opinion would be relevant.

> I think German appetites are well known in Europe going back a millennia. Im hardly the first to note that the Germans have, through the EU, accomplished exactly what they've wanted what they've failed to do in a thousand years of warring.

So the Germans are back at the Reich thing and Frau Merkel is a cover up because we are scared of people with moustaches.

> Read my original comment. I clearly state that I dont know if it was in the treaties or not, however it is a common complaint that there supposedly was an agreement. I then explained why that agreement would make sense, since no rational actor could possibly enter a single market without some safeguards.

So you read it on a blog and you think it makes lots of sense but you can’t explain how? What are these safeguards supposed to be? If Audi makes too many Audis than Frau Merkel has to drive a Fiat Punto?

I don’t think you should continue with this.