[olivermarks]

That's not a compelling reason to buy or continue to own a Tesla.

The fantasy that BEVs are 'much simpler' than ICE vehicles has confused a lot of people. The reality is that the complex electronics, battery management systems etc can only be worked on by Tesla techs with access to DRM protected diagnostics and restricted access online workshop manuals. All modern vehicles, whether ICE, hybrid or BEV are incredibly complex so fewer and fewer people can or want to work on them.

This is a huge problem going forward for everyone. We need to get back to the VW Beetle/Golf etc era where it was possible for even a knowledgable owner could perform major repairs on the vehicle they own, and which were bread and butter for local mechanic shops

[wfhordie]

> That's not a compelling reason to buy or continue to own a Tesla.

Well sure. It’s just the state of the world. I’d expect a Tesla owner to be someone who can handle repairs having to be re-done. They are luxury cars, after all.

For reference, I’ve owned several Teslas and none of them have been at the level of fit and finish appropriate for their price. All of them have needed some finicky part or another fixed under warranty.

The cars, though… they’re just so much fun to drive that all of that doesn’t really matter to me.

I don’t agree that is a huge problem going forward for everyone. I think it’s something that will work itself out given the incentives that Tesla has to get their act together. And it’s not really a problem for the vast majority of owners, who have other options for transport while their car is repaired.

Teslas are not Corollas. Teslas are not “EVs for the Everyman” no matter what Elon says.

I’m not interested in picking up a wrench and working on my own car. I don’t mind that Tesla is sending out newbies to work on cars because I’ll just keep taking it back until I’m satisfied. But, you also couldn’t pay me to go to a traditional dealership.

[doubled112]

Maybe MkIVs ruined me, that's where most of my experience is.

Please never say "back to the VW" and "Beetle" in the same sentence. They're shoehorned together in the worst of ways.

If we're going to go back to the Beetle era where it was easy to work on, I think you have to go back pretty far. That's probably too old for most people.

Completely different than a Golf or Jetta the same years, which usually allows you to get to whatever you'd like. If not, at least the service position let's you yank the engine quick.

[SoftTalker]

The original air cooled Beetle was super simple to work on. Once you had done it a few times, you could pull the engine, rebuild it, and reinstall it in an afternoon (assuming you had parts already on hand).

[olivermarks]

If BEVs are ever to be mass market that ac beetle model needs to be replicated....

[wfhordie]

It already has, in China. China has tons of simple BEVs. Time will tell whether that’s what Americans will want, though.

[olivermarks]

MkIV was a restyled beetle body on a Sirroco floorpan - a modern car. I was talking about the 50's and 60's beetles. That's what a BEV could be at this point if dumbed down https://www.amazon.com/Keep-Volkswagen-Alive-Step-Step/dp/09...

[doubled112]

There has to be something going on with Amazon's pricing model when the paperback of the book you linked is $500.

I'm thinking back really hard, but I don't know if I've ever looked around a 50's/60's Beetle more than a quick glance. If they built a new electric car as cheap and easy as those supposedly were to work on, I'd be very interested.

[olivermarks]

that is weird I agree...you can usually find it in thrift stores for a few dollars

[DennisP]

> DRM protected diagnostics and restricted access online workshop manuals

This sounds like a problem Tesla created for itself, unnecessarily.

Aptera is taking the opposite approach: https://aptera.us/right-to-repair-commitment-feat-rich-rebui...

[olivermarks]

It's true of all car manufacturers this century sadly, not just Tesla

[olivermarks]

Useful video

As Teslas Age | Gruber Motors

https://youtu.be/GcpPyBYRDcM