[chrsig]

I grew up in an incredibly rural town (population ~1200) in new england. I had to walk half a mile down a dirt road to catch a bus at 6:30am. It's often still dark out at this time -- having a later start and still having to do the walk would have actually been safer. Not that it was particularly dangerous. I was more worried about a coyote than anything else. The bus ride was an hour long.

If my parents had time, they'd drive me to the end of the road and let me sit in the car, or if i was lucky drive me to school (allowing me to sleep in more)

> Somebody has to drive the kids to school (hard requirement — there’s no bus and a bike/skateboard is too perilous)

I don't agree with the assessment that there's no bus. If there *really* isn't, change that.

In general: adjust society to make more sense. We know teens have higher sleep requirements. Meet their needs. Find solutions. Work environments can adjust, even if they don't like it.

Maybe well rested teens will be less likely to shoot up the school shrug

[fsckboy]

when I was a teen I was sent to bed at 10, had no trouble falling asleep and got plenty of sleep. I know teens like to rebel and do what they want and stay up late, but that's different than saying it's difficult for them to actually fall asleep at a reasonable hour and it seems rather drastic to rearrange everyone else's schedule to accommodate staying up late playing games and texting

[chrsig]

Research has found that teens need more sleep than adults.

Just some quick results from a google search: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2528821/

https://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/health/healthyliving/tee...

https://www.cdc.gov/healthyschools/features/students-sleep.h...

[fsckboy]

I'm well aware of the research, I'm talking about the scheduling.

And more research will be produced showing that teen clocks are also offset, but it's still the case that I have all my anecdata about what it feels to be tired, to get enough sleep etc., and what it feels like to be a teen rebelling against any rules.

hunter gatherer teens did not sleep late every morning, they had to get up just like everybody else, probably at the crack of dawn