[mr-ron]

What is the scope of this documentation change? Is this a quick edit, or is this a whole new tutorial for new engineers getting their stack up? How long is this going to take?

Do you want an engineer every standup saying 'im working on documentation' without any accountability?

[carlisle_]

You really want to add friction to completing those tasks? How long does it really take to complete any one of those things, and how is a ticket going to change the fact it probably needs to get done anyway? Why am I going to write a ticket for docs I can write in an hour and be done with? Why would you want the docs to stay out of date until a ticket is created, rather than just fixing them?

Frankly I think you missed the point of the article. If you don’t trust your engineers to prioritize their own time when it comes to writing documents, you don’t trust them to do anything. You’re exactly a part of the problem that Will is talking about.

[mr-ron]

I dont really think you are grasping what I am saying. I want engineers to make tickets, and prioritize their time themselves. Creating a ticket to update docs is fine because it allows the engineer to set the scope, and define the audience.

That said, I dont want an engineer spending days on a task that will not bring value, nor do I want work done that will fall through the cracks, or have duplicate work done.

Asking an engineer to create a ticket to create documentation is not the hurdle you think it is.

[malermeister]

I'm a successful engineer. I hate JIRA. I like keeping docs up to date, but if you're gonna make me deal with JIRA's BS just so I can do a quick doc PR, guess what, no updated docs for you.

Where was the value created again?

[sanderjd]

They want full visibility into what everyone is working on all the time. Some managers, especially non-line managers, really like this idea. I can understand why, it sounds really good! Transparency can't be bad, right? In practice, it works a lot better to create fairly small teams, let them run independently and opaquely to the outside, and then coordinate between them periodically (bi-weekly, monthly, quarterly, whatever is found to work best).

[malermeister]

I think one key thing those folks miss is that willpower is a limited resource. For me personally, dealing with bureaucracy drains it much quicker than my actual work product, writing and designing code. Making me track everything is thus a strong net negative on my output.

I'm senior enough to know what I'm doing, so don't make me waste my (and my company's, they're paying me after all!) time.

[carlisle_]

At this point you’re just strawmaning.

[sanderjd]

The original scope that started this thread was "a quick edit". The claim is (or seems to be) that it is not too much friction to require a ticket for everything, which would necessarily include these small edits. That's stupid and will discourage small edits, which is bad, is what people are saying here.

> Do you want an engineer every standup saying 'im working on documentation' without any accountability?

Yes? It isn't any of my business, unless I'm that person's manager, in which case I'll certainly use my 1:1 with that engineer to understand what the documentation changes they're making are all about, and if it seems like a poor use of time then I'll give them a nudge. But if I'm anyone else in this situation, I'll certainly mind my own business.