[robocat]

I suspect there are two constraints working against mini mobiles:

1. The industry push for thin due to the consumer dislike of thick.

2. The invisible consumer expectation that smaller mobiles should be cheaper.

A mini screen with a fat body (large battery, good camera) is what many functionally oriented people should want, but cost and form will limit consumer desire and make it an extremely niche product?!?

Edit: I am thinking more Canon IXUS cross bred with a 20000mAh powerbank and stock Android One. In fact Canon or another reliable camera brand would be the perfect manufacturer. Fat and robust could work: sell the functionally ugly to practical tradesmen type? Unfortunately writer desires thin and light, which I don’t care about. No need for front-facing camera, instead put a 1” (4:3?) screen on the side of the main camera to allow for pointing/framing when doing selfies.

Functionally oriented people often have other constraints. I have tight constraints for mobiles: I am price sensitive (I break or lose phones), I want vanilla Android (manufacturer skinned often has broken upgrades & broken privacy & broken features), and I generally won’t buy products from extremely niche brands (unpredictable reliability, & trust issues).

[Miraste]

It's been tried. Although it could've been a better design, it didn't go over well.

https://thenextweb.com/news/bad-news-for-anyone-who-wanted-t...

[robocat]

¡Awesome! Even if shit execution, fugly, one-trick gimmick, with terrible branding.

* “Other manufacturers have managed to make a success of selling high-capacity smartphones. BlackView (and, for that matter, Ulephone, Doogee, and AGM) does especially well. Although they come with ginormous cells, they’re primarily designed to be hardy, and can take more of a beating than Mickey Rourke in the boxing ring.”

* “French smartphone manufacturer Avenir Telecom attempted to crowdfund the P18K on Indiegogo, but ultimately failed in a way that was previously unthinkable for a project that’s attracted so much press coverage and public interest. In total, Avenir Telecom ‘sold’ sixteen (absolute) units.”

* “there are people who would benefit from a phone with a 18,000 mAh battery. I’m talking about military users, people working in the oil and gas industry, famers, and even truckers. Avenir did nothing to cater to this valuable niche.”

* “The P18K, on the other hand, lacked waterproofing and shockproofing, making it thoroughly unsuitable for outdoor users.”

* “Avenir Telecom wanted €600 for a phone with the internals of a €200 phone. Without anything extra – like ruggedization – that’s a hard sell. It just didn’t represent good value for customers.”

* “Measuring several inches thick”

I was exaggerating a little by saying 20000mAh: about 5000 to 10000 would probably be sweet.

Also camera lenses on the P18K were not flush with reverse side - ugggh. There should be a proper shutter button (positioning and half-press to hold focus). Lenses needs protection eg. manual sliding shutter which when opened puts phone into camera mode (I have cracked mobile phone camera lenses).

Plenty of people want a proper waterproof camera (low light, macro, Tele, optical image stabilisation) in their pocket, and why not combine that with hardy mobile phone?

I can imagine making the screen plus battery plus the USB port all as a single user-replaceable part? Those are the usual culprits that get broken or need replacing.

Edit: Slight edits above for clarity. Also see Blackview Pro 11000mAh https://thenextweb.com/news/this-bonkers-chinese-phone-holds...

[hattmall]

I love the big battery stuff but I don't see how it's profitable because powerbanks, powerbanks cases, and even magnetic or clipon wireless charging powerbanks exist and can cheaply be tailored to fit tons of phones. What benefit would a massive battery confer over a massive battery bank case. One that would be swappable / replaceable. I only recently gave up my S5 with a 10,000mAh extended battery. But with powerbanks and wireless charging it doesn't seem like a real market anymore.

[efreak]

> powerbanks, powerbanks cases, and even magnetic or clipon wireless charging powerbanks exist and can cheaply be tailored to fit tons of phones

This is true. This is also irrelevant if nobody actually does it. My nexus 7 tablet survived 6 years with a dead battery due to having qi charging. For every phone I've bought since then, I have searched for charging cases and not found even a single one at the time. This includes the moto e2, moto G5, moto G6, and my current Samsung phone (a32 or something, can't recall at the moment; it's the free T-Mobile 5g phone). Basically I wanted something that ideally supported wireless charging, but at minimum was semi-permanently attached to the charging port (charger built into the case itself to protect my port).

[Miraste]

I think 20000mAh is achievable now. I have a 20k battery pack on my desk and it’s pocketable, if heavy. Much thinner than the Energizer phone. I’m picturing your phone design as an original Galaxy Fold, but solid instead of the hinge/internal screen. The chassis could fit more than a 10k battery easily, and the shape is simple to ruggedize.

> Avenir Telecom wanted €600 for a phone with the internals of a €200 phone.

This is the big issue. Avenue’s not to blame here. It’s unavoidable, the design is just too non-standard.

If you could get a military contract then it might work.

[fomine3]

* Small battery capacity

* Lower performance due to small battery and poorer heat dissipation

* No physical space to put top-tier camera

[Dylan16807]

The battery doesn't have to be small if you're okay with moderate thickness. And a lot of power goes to the screen so that cancels out. To the extent that this is true, you're just restating "push for thin" and it's not a separate problem.

Lower performance than what? I'm not convinced that's a real issue unless you're trying to make a flagship.

Why couldn't you fit a top-tier camera? That's like a square centimeter.

[robocat]

> That's like a square centimeter.

I was thinking much larger optics and mechanicals, similar to a PowerShot N (except with modern video specs): Optical image stabilization, 8x optical zoom, 1/2.3" Sensor (6.17mm x 4.55 mm), Maximum aperture F3–5.9, Macro focus range 1cm. A real camera: even though I realise in the past there have been plenty of failed camera-phones in the marketplace!

https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Canon+PowerShot+N+Teardown/6...

https://m.dpreview.com/products/canon/compacts/canon_n/speci...

[Dylan16807]

Oh, well that's just a phone limitation, not a small phone limitation.