[debacle]

New York is losing population at a breakneck pace. Our government is to blame.

I am for single payer to some extent, but if done poorly medical staff (who are already leaving due to pandemic policies) will just pick up and leave.

We recently expanded the privileges of nurse practitioners which is great, but two large nursing unions are less than 60 days away from striking.

[joshstrange]

Citation needed. Every population graph I can find show a small decline over the last few years but it's still above 2000 and they've had population dips before (1970-1980) that then recovered.

This comment reads like my in-laws who always talk about how "people can't get out of CA fast enough", um the population numbers say otherwise.

[pirate787]

"A smaller Empire State: New York continues to lead nation in population decline"

https://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/news/politics/alb...

The population flight is primarily for US-born residents, which is what happened in CA as well.

[jliptzin]

From the article:

"Most of New York's population decline has been upstate."

[q1w2]

One of the main errors that people miss is that the people leaving California and New York are the people making money and paying tax revenues.

Covid CRUSHED NYC tax revenues - and many people have still not returned.

[timtom39]

CA is losing population: https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Bay-Area-countie... It isn't crazy fast but it is happening. We will see if the trend holds...

[UnpossibleJim]

How much of this do you think comes from the Bay Area and Los Angeles housing costs and the ability to remote work in the last couple of years (which seems to be coming to an end... possibly) and how much do you think is because of policy and city deterioration which has been publicized?

I can't speak for CA but I see parallels in Seattle, though there's only movement to other cities within other WA cities (mainly the east side).

[majormajor]

The common refrain is very Yogi-Berra-like, "nobody lives there anymore, it's too crowded."

Few people on the right want to connect things like rising homelessness -> rising rents and property values in the same period -> an influx of high paying jobs. There aren't concrete policy proposals given to fix those things given the circumstances of the last decade, just finger-pointing at whatever particularly policy someone doesn't like. The amount of gymnastics done to blame anything other than "importing a bunch of high-earners and/or wealthy people has unintended consequences" is high. E.g., pointing to pre-Covid out-migration overall numbers while ignoring net in-migration within the US for earners over 100K/yr. (I haven't seen if this has changed post-Covid, it wouldn't suprise me if it has, but one would want to keep an eye on it over the next two years as policies around WFH shift, of course.)

[Mountain_Skies]

Why would you even mention "the right" in any conversation involving the governance of San Francisco? What level of control does a party need before accepting responsibility for their governing instead of looking for an exiled boogeyman to blame?

[bombcar]

I’ve seen people argue that the lack of complete unity on CA politics is the cause of all problems; e.g. the right is still to blame.

[PaulDavisThe1st]

Well, even CA still operates under the basic assumptions of contemporary US capitalism. There's a notable limit to what you can accomplish in terms of social change when you still cannot (or refuse to) directly control housing costs (for example), or control capital flows, or the labor share of (in this case, state) GDP.

While there are some great analyses that point out the flaws and hypocrisy in Democratic governance within CA, I think it's also equally true to say that the state's "left" leaning situation ends up pointing out the inherent contradictions of contemporary US capitalism as well as anything could.

[timtom39]

I lived in SF for ~8 years and left during COVID and bought a house. I have worked remote for 5 years (long before covid). My quality of life is just better not living in SF. I should have left earlier. It is all of the reasons you listed and more.

Also, I am a startup junkie and avoiding CA's 13% capital gains has more than offset any pay cut I might take by working remote (which hasn't happened).

[nradov]

Our public school district in the south Bay Area had been steadily losing enrollment. I talked to one of the administrators and she said that based on student records transfer requests, the most common destination outside of California was Texas.

[dwighttk]

NY had been holding steady at about 6.5% of the US population since around 2010, but recently dipped just below 6%

https://united-states.reaproject.org/analysis/comparative-tr...

[astura]

Doesn't sound like a "breakneck pace."

[tootie]

I don't see how expanding coverage will have any bearing on the quality of care givers. It's going to be the exact same doctors and nurses, just compensated from a different source.

[OrvalWintermute]

> We recently expanded the privileges of nurse practitioners which is great, but two large nursing unions are less than 60 days away from striking.

The problem is that NPs are not fundamentally trained in diagnosis and have huge gaps in their medical training compared to physicians.

In the best case you go to an NP for a simple scrip. In the worst case you see a series of NPs and never get an accurate diagnosis, leading to a circular series of appointments.

NP = 2 year program on top of a 4 year nursing degree.

Physician = 1-3 years of fellowship (optional) + 3-7 years of residency + 4 year medical school on top of a 4 year bachelors degree