[Gh0stRAT]

RE chargebacks: stolen cards are often monetized these days with a scheme known as "triangle fraud". Here's how it works:

0) the scammer somehow acquires Person A's credit card info

1) the scammer sets up an online store on Amazon or similar and sells some popular item at a 20% discount (eg Nespresso pods)

2) the scammer doesn't actually have that item in stock, but when they get an order from Person B, they use the stolen card to place another order with a legitimate seller and set the destination address to Person B's address (basically drop-shipping but where the victim is paying for the cost of the goods being sold)

3) Now the scammer has received already-laundered clean money from an online transaction, and Person B got the product they wanted on-time and at a steep discount. They're happy, and certainly won't be complaining to their credit card company.

4) when Person A reports their card stolen and tries to perform a chargeback, the legitimate seller who acted as an unwitting drop-shipper ends up eating the cost.

[d4mi3n]

DEFCON 27 had a talk on exactly this by Nina Kollars, which I suspect is where the Nespresso reference comes from. It's an excellent overview of the topic of triangle fraud. :)

DEF CON 27 - Confessions of an Nespresso Money Mule Free Stuff and Triangulation Fraud: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fYZpRBuh-s

[alexb_]

Almost impressed at the cleverness of this all! Especially since, if it's done right, all parties see "business as usual" - and even if they DO suspect a scam, nobody has any incentive past a moral one to say anything.

[danachow]

Wait what? The person with the stolen credit card will report the fraudulent charge causing a chargeback for the seller - how is that “business as usual”? If the business is getting hit with chargebacks they sure as fuck have a financial motivation if not moral one to report it.

This relies on churn and hoping that a percentage of the fraudulent charges go unnoticed. But if it’s oversight then it’s not really that party “seeing” anything.

[alexb_]

Someone noticing they are being scammed means that it's over anyways. What I'm saying is that, as the scam is happening, you are going to get at least 1 "legit" looking transaction where the cash is already in the scammer's hands. The person with the stolen credit card is often someone elderly or unable to notice major financial decisions, which makes them perfect marks for being scammed in the first place. What I'm saying is that, to all the parties involved except the scammer, there is no obvious signs that something fishy is going on.