[clay_shirky]

This whole thread is giving me feels, but to the basics, I'll tell you how it happened.

I'd been writing about what we came to call social media since the early 90s (alt.culture.usenet and alt.folklore.urban ftw), but by the middle of last decade, all anyone wanted to talk to me about was marketing on Facebook, which was the boringest possible topic.

At the same time, my wordpress host had lousy security, and my site was getting frequently disabled because of some malicious javascript uploaded through some hole they hand't patched. I wasn't writing there anymore, so it was pure cost at that point, and cost of my time, not just dollars.

Then I moved to Shanghai for several years, working on other stuff, and fixed the site a couple of times again, and one time, my host was like "We disabled your site!" because of their own security flaws had let it get hacked again, which, the whole thing had entered 'ugh field'territory.

I never decided to let the site lapse, I was just tired of dealing with it, and the political circumstances in both China and the U.S. seemed much more urgent than rescuing some historical essays, so one day at a time of not dealing with it became years.

And here we are, me reading my own eulogy. Which is incredibly flattering and touching, I have to say.

I'm not even sure what of it can be resuscitated -- maybe if I want it back, I'll have to copy it from Wayback (and will say "Thank you Brewster", not for the first time), but if anyone here has advice about competent and secure hosting for an old Wordpress blog, hmu at [e-mail], because reading this, it makes me embarassed not to have just fucking fixed this a year or two ago.

And thanks, all, for this thread. -clay

[JPKab]

Clay,

Just want to thank you for your great work.

I used to work on a lot of US Department of Defense projects, mostly stuff I can't talk about. One very notable project I CAN talk about was an initiative (pushed by utterly clueless, insular, and frankly corrupt academics) to spend billions of dollars in 2008-2010 timeframe on implementing Semantic Web technologies in various military business systems across the DoD.

As an actual technologist who knew how to build things, I was perpetually in the awful position of having to explain to leadership that these highly credentialed academics were selling garbage. I had tried to implement systems according to their design. The graph databases they pushed (they hated Neo4J, for reasons of purity because it didn't actually use RDF/OWL in the database...... i get a headache just talking about this...) were slow piles of dogshit that couldn't scale. No amount of reality could dissuade the academics. They had their theories, and any collision with reality was merely an implementation detail that I and my team were simply too incompetent to overcome in their eyes. Almost none of them had actual technical experience. A smattering of Comp Sci folks, and a ton of "Library Science" idiots.

Your essays on why the SemWeb was utter bullshit were a potent weapon I used with the generals the academics were pushing, and I eventually got the generals funding the project to see the light. Got them cancelled, and sent the idiot egg-heads packing. I still see them on LinkedIn to this day. They desperately continue trying to push that rock up the hill, and only recently warmed to more practical graph database solutions.

They HATED YOU. It was hilarious, watching them try to refute your obvious points and clear writing with jargon and hand-waving. Utterly unconvincing to the generals.

Thanks for your essays saving my ass back then!

[clay_shirky]

You cannot possibly know how much this delights me!

Most of my writing was about social media, back when the web was young, but "Ontology is Overrated" is actually my favorite thing I ever wrote, and it makes me happy beyond measure to know that it helped someone manage an actual argument over whether to buy into the semantic web!

I have never been talented enough to write production code, but I often thought of myself as trying to provide ammunition to people like you who are, when talking to bosses who didn't understand that the phrase "Now it's just a simple matter of programming!" was a bitter, sardonic joke, not an upbeat assessment of possibility.

Thank you for telling this story! This whole thread has been like hearing my own eulogy, but this in particular is just :chefs_kiss:

[JPKab]

Awesome! Yeah man, you nailed it all on the head back then, and yes, saved my ass. Sorry the thread felt like a eulogy. You've got a lot of mileage left in you my friend, and I'm looking forward to your future insights on the next big trends none of us are predicting yet.

The response of the academics to your writings was actually a master class for me in the nature of academic corruption and groupthink. What I learned from that experience was that (contrary to my prior beliefs) high IQ individuals are actually far more susceptible to cognitive dissonance than others are, not less so. They are far more adept at mentally constructing rationalizations and false realities that bolster and protect their existing belief systems from new information than most people are. Add to that the fact that they are extremely economically vulnerable to reputational damage, and you have a really toxic recipe.

[Kye]

Library Science is what librarians learn. It's a real thing for a real job. Like most credentials and like most jobs, some people try to over-fit experience and knowledge in one field to another.

You see the same with CompSci/tech people treating data like there's no bias in its collection.

[JPKab]

As I learned from the people on that project with lib sci degrees, the employment prospects are predominantly low-paying, but these ones found a new boondoggle to employ them as "ontologists" where they could get 6 figure salaries to sit around and build models all day in a piece of software called TopBraid Composer. (GUI program built in Eclipse, where users would create diagrams that would then be translated to an XML offshoot called OWL, a W3C standard that's never been successfully used in any meaningful project I've seen) I witnessed these people sit around and create business models and knowledge graphs of arcane Air Force business processes for 3 years (there were literally 9 of them doing this) before the project was cancelled due to its technical impossibility. The ontologies they created were never used once, and when I actually tried to provide them (in PDF form) to a separate project where Air Force personnel were trying to map out business processes, the personnel stated to me (in writing, with a Colonel CC'd) "These are so inaccurate that they are frequently misleading, and cannot be trusted." The Colonel later pulled me into his office and stated (rather comically): "You mean to tell me I've been paying people to draw cartoons for 3 years? We're not goddamned Disney here."

[nl]

I worked in this field with similar people for a few year.

100% concure with this view. The semantic web was one of the biggest wastes if time ever and set back the open web fatally.

[jacquesm]

Great story this. The difference between theory and practice has sunk many, many billions.

[cossatot]

If it's just a collection of essays, what about a static site? You can set one up on Github Pages or Gitlab Pages with a minimum of coding. There are also virtually no security concerns and maintenance is minimal.

You'd have to take all of the text from the Wordpress blog and format it into Markdown but that shouldn't take a huge amount of time unless there is a lot of weird formatting or different media types.

[cxr]

> You'd have to take all of the text from the Wordpress blog and format it into Markdown

No you wouldn't. Just dump it in as-is.

[notRobot]

Indeed. GitHub Pages can serve HTML just fine.

[philipps]

This is absolutely the easiest solution. We did this for open.media.mit.edu in order to archive the old wordpress site. Used wget to fetch all of the HTML and ran a script over it to remove some obvious clutter. Happy to help out. Your writing really shaped the way I thought about the potential of an open internet.

[epeus]

Hi Clay, Kevin Marks here. I an help you scrape it out of wordpress into a static site if you like, I've done similar for Dan Gilmor and other old bloggers. Ping me - [e-mail]

[mdavidn]

You could scrape the site, either from Wayback or from WordPress, if you manage to get it working just briefly, and then host the site statically out of an S3 bucket. wget has an option to recursively crawl and save a site, but there are other tools.

https://docs.aws.amazon.com/AmazonS3/latest/userguide/Websit...

[lathiat]

You’ll never maintain a Wordpress site long term securely. Need to convert it to static html one way or another.

[egypturnash]

10y of http://egypt.urnash.com running on Wordpress with a small set of plugins, including one for security, says otherwise.

[wolrah]

> You’ll never maintain a Wordpress site long term securely. Need to convert it to static html one way or another.

I'm in favor of static HTML myself where possible, but it's not hard to maintain a secure Wordpress install. Keep automatic updates enabled and don't install any third party plugins.

It's that second part that most people screw themselves with.

[rob74]

It may not be very hard to maintain, but you still have to maintain it. Whereas if you just have a collection of articles that you want to keep around as an archive, if you convert them to a static site, you can basically forget about them afterward...

[wolrah]

> It may not be very hard to maintain, but you still have to maintain it.

When the maintenance is "ensure auto updates are on, and don't do anything that would not get updated automatically" it's not like it requires regular effort.

> Whereas if you just have a collection of articles that you want to keep around as an archive, if you convert them to a static site, you can basically forget about them afterward...

Your web server, your operating system, etc. still require at bare minimum the same level of maintenance.

You can outsource that maintenance to someone else of course, but you can do the same with WP as well.

--

My point is that WP alone doesn't massively increase the maintenance burden, it's what people tend to do with (to?) WP that increases the burden and eventually leads to unmaintained sites.

[bryanrasmussen]

>When the maintenance is "ensure auto updates are on, and don't do anything that would not get updated automatically" it's not like it requires regular effort.

no dog in the fight here but I felt impelled to point out that ensuring auto updates are on solves almost all security holes except for the security hole it opens up.

[wolrah]

> no dog in the fight here but I felt impelled to point out that ensuring auto updates are on solves almost all security holes except for the security hole it opens up.

In almost any computing context, but especially in the context of a personal blog, the vast majority of exploits are against known security holes for which patches have already been released and those with automatic updates enabled are already safe from.

Yes, hypothetically updates can deliver new flaws of their own and even potentially intentional malicious code, but from a practical sense it's not worth worrying about if you're using mainstream software packages on a major OS.

[DonHopkins]

>it's not like it requires regular effort

More effort that you'll be able to exert when you're dead.

[davidandgoliath]

I assure you it'd be a whole lot easier for your survivors to manage a WP install than it would be to figure out your Jekyll configs.

[lathiat]

Right. I should have clarified it’s unlikely to happen if you want to be hands off for years at a time. If that’s the goal the ideal state is to convert it to static.

[Fnoord]

That's true for any piece of networked software. In reality, unattended-upgrades makes life easy.

[dannyobrien]

WP security has come a long way. I've had a site up for over a decade, and while I used to be VERY nervous, now with automatic updates and a fair amount of code-hardening, it really hasn't been a problem.

[karjaluoto]

Another approach might be to toss it on blot.im. (I’m in no way affiliated with Blot, but I like how simple the product is.)

[Fnoord]

Wordpress itself is reasonably secure nowadays. It is the plugins which are a mess.

[jacquesm]

What strikes me is how timeless your writing is. My own stuff is hit-and-miss, the bulk of it has a best before date measured in a few weeks or months but yours is just as relevant today as when you wrote it and that takes some real talent, not just in writing but also in the depth of insight that you have on this things.

Thank you for all of it!

[DoreenMichele]

I only know of you because of The Shirky Principle, which was very valuable to me in figuring out what's wrong with homeless services and that we need to focus on fixing housing instead. Thank you for your work and for stopping by to respond here.

Good luck with restoring your site.

[teddyh]

If you don’t want to talk about marketing on Facebook, letting your own web site lapse and disappear seems like the last thing that you’d want to do.

(See https://theoatmeal.com/comics/reaching_people_2021)

[akavel]

Try to take a look at wpengine.com; they're not the cheapest, but I heard they have very good support people, and via some business relations I had with them, I know they have a system for auto-updating wordpress plugins.

[derefr]

> competent and secure hosting for an old Wordpress blog

Amusingly, nobody here has stated the obvious: wordpress.com.