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by commandlinefan 1540 days ago
I've never seen somebody who opposes meritocracy actual suggest taking starting points into consideration - instead, they demand that easily observable, intrinsic physical characteristics be used as a proxy for "starting point".
1 comments
MiroF 1540 days ago
But there are a number of studies demonstrating how race & class impact things (when controlled for other factors) like teacher perception, grading, letters of recommendation, not to mention just the fact that if you are growing up in a black (or white) household that has $5 in wealth, you'll have less access to educational opportunity than the white (or black, albeit far more rarely) household with $200,000 in wealth.

We shouldn't seek to control for these factors?

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pishpash 1540 days ago
No. That only tells you to fix those factors but the outcome is what they are. By the time of the ACT/SAT test it's too late to fix those things. Fix those upstream.
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MiroF 1540 days ago
> By the time of the ACT/SAT test it's too late to fix those things. Fix those upstream.

Based on?? If someone is smart, but denied opportunity, often times this can be resolved by exposure to things - even for an 18 year old.

Indeed, environmental factors become less important for intelligence starting precisely at this age.

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pishpash 1540 days ago
Based on this MIT press release stating that controlling for socio-economic factors test score was still significant in predicting outcome in college. You want to challenge that you need to come up with data.

18 years of growth differences cannot be made up by "exposure to things" from age 18-22. It helps, but it does not resolve it. If someone is truly smart they will score well on the not-very-difficult ACT/SAT without any test prep in the first place. These are stupidly easy tests by international standards. Just suck it up and recognize that at the high level that these schools operate at, if you are below a certain score range, you are not ready, regardless of how many "opportunities" you are given.

That's not to say that some people aren't capable in other ways and will do just fine in life, but these schools are not for them.

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