[coolso]

> Bodybuilding.com misc & 4chan are super toxic communities.

There’s that word. The world is super “toxic”. The aforementioned sites allow people to speak freely, which can result in negativity, but they’re also bastions of freedom and creativity and everyone’s thoughts being equally visible.

One can easily argue that that’s far less toxic than Reddit’s style of everyone being the church mom that silences and admonishes everyone that says something “problematic” or what the congregation considers unacceptable. Where’s the fun in that?

There’s definitely a certain group of people who hate not being able to silence others, since if they can’t silence and censor their opponents, their arguments don’t really hold up.

[n4r9]

4chan is a bastion of free speech in the same way that Somalia is a bastion of the free market. Being the only place in the world to do something "freely" means you mostly attract people that want to "freely" do all the things that other places have rules against.

[irobeth]

I'm reminded of the quote:

"The only freedom which counts is the freedom to do what some other people think to be wrong. There is no point in demanding freedom to do that which all will applaud. All the so-called liberties or rights are things which have to be asserted against others; who claim that if such things are to be allowed, their own rights are infringed or their own liberties threatened. This is always true, even when we speak of the freedom to worship, of the right of free speech or association, or of public assembly. If we are to allow freedoms at all there will constantly be complaints that either the liberty itself or the way in which it is exercised is being abused, and, if it is a genuine freedom, these complaints will often be justified. There is no way of having a free society in which there is not abuse. Abuse is the very hallmark of liberty."

[barry-cotter]

Why the scare quotes? If you’re in favor of censorship why not own it?

[n4r9]

The previous comment was using the word "free" as if it had a clear and self-evident meaning. But of course it does not - theres a huge grey area where individual liberty conflicts with the rights of others. Where is appropriate to draw the line in this area is culturally dependent. But most cultures agree that there is a line somewhere - for example even the US has certain laws regulating hate speech, and prevents individuals from having the "freedom" to enslave other humans. In this sense, everyone except an extreme few is in favour of censorship. It's just a matter of degree.

[Werewolf255]

By that logic are you also condoning revenge porn and other actions which violate another person's consent? If you're in favor of it, why not own it?

[hef19898]

You freedom ends where my nose begins, or something like that. The freedom to voice your opinions, even unpopular ones, is good. It stops being good once it turns to online harassment, IMHO even before that.

And by the way, just because there is no active moderation doesn't mean that every voice is equally heard. Or did any one on running.com listen what Dr. Meza had to say?

[bluecalm]

Man, Dr. Meza was an obvious chatear who refused to stop. He could have silenced it all by running with a GPS way before it snowballed to what you call harassment. He deserved to have his reputation ruined. You're just blaming victims (the ones cheated) for doing something about it. You can't have a world where the cheater keeps his profits from cheating and his victims are not hurt by it. It's not a positive sum game, something gotta give. Don't blame the victims.

[hef19898]

You know what's an easy way? Just don't let him compete anymore. Like what grown ups do. Amateur sports turned into cesspool.

[daniel-cussen]

They did that! One marathon banned him, many ordered him to run with an observer, he was told to cut the shit over and over, and he violated those rules. He was banned, don't say he wasn't.

[hef19898]

So, he wasn't competing anymore. What ever times he "ran" didn't matter anymore. People could have left it there, why didn't they? And why would any of that justify the online bullying campaign against him?

[daniel-cussen]

If he wasn't competing he could have just raced without a bib, or just run around town on his own at 5am, nobody would have cared about his teleporting. He called that attention to himself and kept cheating until the absolute second he got called out and demanded to run with an observer to put up or shut up.

[Lascaille]

>And why would any of that justify the online bullying campaign against him?

Pour encourager les autres.

[Lascaille]

Very well said.