[nickysielicki]

> [Domestic support] doesn't really matter though, what matters is that they are there illegally. A lot of Germans supported the invasion of Poland as well to gain some 'lebensraum'. That did not make them right.

You’re moving the goal posts. You suggested that the Russian people could or should stage mass protests. I responded that you’re naive for thinking that Russians are going to stage mass protests against this because there’s large public support for the military actions here. Now you’re saying it doesn’t matter if there’s support for the war because it’s still wrong and illegal. Well, no shit?

So which is it? Is it Putin acting as a dictator against the will of his people in a desperate attempt to retain power, or is it just that the Russians support those in the Donbas region?

[jacquesm]

You are apparently utterly unaware of the reality on the ground in Russia, which I can't fault you for but it makes the discussion a bit tedious. FWIW: your 'average Russian' may well grumble at Putin, the hardships the country is operating under and the effect that sanctions will have on their already fragile economy. But they're likely not going to act, this has to do with living like that for the last 75 years or so. That does not mean that they support the invasion of Ukraine, but it does mean that when asked about this they are aware that whoever is asking it may have an agenda so of course they will say that they support it.

But it's not as simple as support vs a lack of support, the third option is apathy, something that Russia has plenty of.

I tried to show you - apparently that didn't work - that verbal support for Putin's safari does not necessarily equate to actual support, the alternatives are probably not even on the radar if you haven't lived under a repressive regime: you are very careful to toe the party line in public, no matter what you may think in private, and bitching against the state is a cottage industry in Russia. Given all this, what is surprising is that plenty of Russians are actually quite vocal against this invasion, which I consider to be a very positive sign.

https://www.voanews.com/a/moscow-warns-russians-against-stag...

and

https://www.businessinsider.com/russia-arrests-anti-war-prot...

> Is it Putin acting as a dictator against the will of his people in a desperate attempt to retain power

Yes

> or is it just that the Russians support those in the Donbas region?

Yes.

So there: false dichotomies are false, reality is a bit more difficult than you can imagine.