[ivan_gammel]

> The why go to war over something symbolic?

They are not going to war. They just expand their presence on the borders to make a point. If NATO feels menace with those deployments, they are expected to understand that Russia feels the same. If NATO is not making commitment on paper not to expand and to scale down their current presence, Russia will not make commitments to stop those annual military exercises they have been doing for years.

[AutumnCurtain]

Have you rethought these comments at all, Ivan?

[ivan_gammel]

Yes. They remain valid as a way of thought for many Russians before the war and should be kept for history. Hardly anyone in Russia was considering real war as a possibility, so when Putin made the orders it came as a deep shock. Before the recognition of separatist territories, his strategy seemed at least rational if wrong. He could be understood, even if his actions were not approved. Not anymore. I do not know when this transition happened, when the last red line was crossed by him in his mind, but now it is total uncertainty. Whatever he planned with this invasion, his calculations are so obviously mistaken, that it is hard to understand how this decision was made at the first place. It will not help Russia to achieve any long term or short term goals and it will jeopardize his own rule. Now he is certified crazy. And this is scary as shit.

[jacquesm]

Thank you for coming back and adding this. Indeed, it is scary as shit, and because now any kind of trust in whatever Russia says or claims is lost there is absolutely no way to contain this. Russia could join peace negotiations and it wouldn't amount to anything. This does not have a happy ending I'm afraid.

Best of luck. We'll probably all need it.

[AutumnCurtain]

Thank you very much for the perspective, I think people all around the world are shocked at his brazenness and even people who were "right" about his plans are horrified to be so.