[WesolyKubeczek]

I dunno, getting inspired and copying all the ideas, deciding that they can do a good enough job internally instead of hiring Keivan doesn’t sound like a bad thing in and of itself.

It’s the stringing along that makes my blood boil. After reading things like this, I’m thinking, what I’d do differently?

Maybe have them reimburse all my travel upfront. No money, no meetings.

Also, bill all the meetings and conversations. Up front, given their reputation from this story. They want to spend my time, better show how serious they are. No money, no meetings, no false hopes.

But they know young geeks can be excited that someone at THE Microsoft noticed them, like in the Hollywood success stories, and walk an extra mile. Who knows, I could have lost my shit 20 years ago. This straight up exploitation irks me to no end. Reminds me of rock stars bedding teenage fangirls and similar shit, maybe this is why.

[john_moscow]

>I dunno, getting inspired and copying all the ideas, deciding that they can do a good enough job internally instead of hiring Keivan doesn’t sound like a bad thing in and of itself.

It just completely kills the motivation to make any kind of system tools like this. If your tool fails, you have wasted your time. If it succeeds, the OS vendor will kill it overnight with a free knock-off, so you have also wasted your time.

OS/platform vendors should know it better if they want to maintain a thriving ecosystem of contributors, but nobody seems to care anymore. Shops knocking off most successful products with store brands, Apple doing the same with some popular apps, Amazon Basics, this. And then we wonder why so many people are depressed and don't see a future for themselves anymore.

[WesolyKubeczek]

You do these tools for yourself and to scratch your own itch. As long as it fulfills its function, you get value. The fact that someone else may want to use it or the big vendor would like to adopt it should be secondary at best.

If you yourself don’t need such a tool and you also don’t want to do it as an exercise of the art, then don’t do it. Spend your time on something that’s gonna bring value to you instead.

[piyh]

You could release your code with a less permissive license (say excluding companies with a 1 trillion dollar market cap) so they at least have to play ball with you.

[chasil]

The GPLv3 might be enough to do that, for some. It was sufficient concern for Apple, who dumped Samba, bash, and gcc.

Microsoft's CBL/Mariner distribution of Linux would be the first place to look for GPLv3, and and impacts upon their patent portfolio (I haven't read up on the patent provisions).

"Apple, a user of GCC and a heavy user of both DRM and patents, switched the compiler in its Xcode IDE from GCC to Clang, which is another FOSS compiler but is under a permissive license. LWN speculated that Apple was motivated partly by a desire to avoid GPLv3. The Samba project also switched to GPLv3, so Apple replaced Samba in their software suite by a closed-source, proprietary software alternative."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_and_open-source_software#...

[908B64B197]

LLVM is also more modular. The front-end and back-ends are well decoupled and it’s possible to work on them separately. Useful for a company that has to target two CPU architectures.

[chasil]

I have heard that many optimizations that llvm can make are impossible in GCC.

I barely grasp yacc, but I understand that a more cohesive design, less burdened by history, can be greatly effective.

There is a group that is trying to rework Linux in such a way that it can be compiled by llvm clang. I wish them the best.

[WesolyKubeczek]

If these companies think they can get away with unlicensed use, they will. It’s you going broke because of a lawsuit, not them even if they lose.

[indymike]

>I dunno, getting inspired and copying all the ideas, deciding that they can do a good enough job internally instead of hiring Keivan doesn’t sound like a bad thing in and of itself.

This is one of these things where you have to go, what did they loose by not investing in or hiring Keivan? Would the product be better, would it have got more traction, etc. Here's a juxtaposition: MS bought Github (yes, bigger scale) and chose not to build their own. The result was really good for MS, and honestly, not bad for Github users. MS needs to get better (and they are getting better) at using investment and acquisition instead of brainfscking and re-innovating. To be fair, maybe there's more to the story?