[csdvrx]

> For a person with enough money he seems to work harder than he should to obtain more and more.

Some people like to max their points in videogames. Other like to max their $ in real life.

The beauty of capitalism is that the effort of the latter end up benefiting us all.

[ipaddr]

He can't say I have enough points I don't need anymore. Use my high points as a reason to trust me that I will make less points than others if you shop here.

I also spend all of my time and energy trying to get more points.

[LordDragonfang]

>The beauty of capitalism is that the effort of the latter end up benefiting us all.

There are countless examples of that not being the case. At best, it benefits some other people most of the time and, arguably most people only some of the time.

Keep in mind that all of the current issues with US healthcare are also caused by individuals trying to maximize their personal dollars - at the expense of the general public.

[friedturkey]

Capitalism is what got America into its health care mess. Other countries aren't paying thousands for simple pills or insulin.

[adventured]

When has the US had a Capitalist market for healthcare?

The US has a particularly horrible hyper regulated, government shielded, cartel-based healthcare system and has for decades - the time during which its healthcare costs have skyrocketed out of control.

The US could hardly be further away from Capitalism in how its healthcare system is structured.

[friedturkey]

If you really think dropping regulations and making it a free for all for multi-billion dollar corporations to fiddle with our health would improve anything, you're simply lying lol

Countries with more regulation and more control by the state have... prices that are a fraction of the US. Surprise. Just like countries with stricter environmental restrictions have fewer clear-cut forests, less polluted water, etc. Unbridled capitalism means more money at the top at the cost of everyone else. There's a balance to be found between making money and having some restraints.

[s1artibartfast]

The US has a ton of regulations that other countries don't. It tries to regulate interactions between all kinds of private companies that don't even exist in other markets. It has tougher standards restricting the supply of health care workers, preventing new hospitals from competing on price, and preventing new generics from entering the market. Also a vast amount of regulation around coupling health insurance to employers.

Most of these regulations don't exist in countries because there are top down price negotiations and/or universal healthcare.

The US regulation is the worst of both worlds.

[csdvrx]

> Countries with more regulation and more control by the state have... prices that are a fraction of the US.

Funny enough, the quality and ease of access (delays for procedures etc) also "are a fraction of the US"

[friedturkey]

Nice baseless FUD that's completely wrong. :)

As an American, my longest waits and worst care were all in the US. I pay just a couple bucks in Japan and get far better, far faster care. Pissing blood from a major kidney infection and hospitals politely turning me away because my insurance was out of network and "oh this is too expensive for you. Try (next hospital that rejected me)" wasn't fun. Never had an experience like that outside the US. Here it’s “Do you have an appointment? No? Okay, we’ll see you in a few minutes.”

Not sure why Americans believe this meme, but it's very apparent that someone hasn't spent any significant time outside the country and is informed exclusively by facebook fearmongering when they say that. It's always "yeah, I know a guy who knows a guy who read an article saying the UK is worse!" America has massive delays for procedures already--the excuse doesn't work anymore.

But yes, the delays in Japan and the cost are a fraction of the US, and it's because there's more regulation. It's wonderful.

[owlninja]

>Not sure why Americans believe this meme, but it's very apparent that someone hasn't spent any significant time outside the country and is informed exclusively by facebook fearmongering when they say that. It's always "yeah, I know a guy who knows a guy who read an article saying the UK is worse!"

Well I guess now I know a person on hackernews with a story?

[LordDragonfang]

Having government regulations doesn't make something not capitalist. Capitalism is defined by an economic system where you can profit off of simply owning Capital (i.e. the means of production) without having to work it.

Per Wikipedia:

> Capitalism is an economic system based on the private ownership of the means of production and their operation for profit. Central characteristics of capitalism include capital accumulation, competitive markets, price system, private property, property rights recognition, voluntary exchange, and wage labor.

All of these things are true of the US healthcare market.

[bushbaba]

It’s not capitalist. Heck try even getting a price quote online for a pharmaceutical drug. Oh wait you can’t as “it depends”.

Why the government hasn’t stepped in, is pure corruption.

[friedturkey]

I mean, you said the government not stepping in is the problem, and the source of that problem is money...

That's just what capitalism is. There is no ideal world where people max out their earnings and say "haha i'll be a friendly competitor and work for the benefit of the people :))))". People with vested interests will always push for less regulation, and the consequence of a successful push is never "everyone is better off and paying less!" Other developed countries have more regulation and lower prices. That's simply a fact.