[exceptione]

> This usually happens after you've created plenty of opportunities for the person to improve. Often that just doesn't happen

Doesn´t that mean you the employer failed too? It could be that someone is really not well fit for the role, but it could also be that the employer has no clue how to lead someone to success. As you say

> I'm often pleasantly surprised to see that people moved on and improved themselves

This is for me an indication that the employer lacks critical skills and needs improvement. Being a checklist manager and demanding improvement is the easy part, but making people grow in the direction you want is the hard part.

[jillesvangurp]

That's a very one sided view. It assumes the employee always means well and is super motivated to adapt and change. Or even capable of changing. When all that stops being true, it's usually quite obvious. The mistake is allowing such a situation to continue to exist and not intervening. Every dysfunctional team you've ever been on, that's what happened.

As a manager/supervisor/mentor, I've coached more than a few people to success to know that I'm actually objectively good at this. Quite a few people I've worked with have gone on to be extremely successful in what they do. And I like to think I helped them on that path a little. But there are exceptions to this where indeed I failed to get people off their ass and improve themselves. A handful of those situations escalated to the point where letting them go was the next logical step. Some people are just fundamentally hard to coach or even open to being coached.

[exceptione]

> It assumes the employee always means well and is super motivated to adapt and change. Or even capable of changing. When all that stops being true, it's usually quite obvious. The mistake is allowing such a situation to continue to exist and not intervening. > As a manager/supervisor/mentor, I've coached more than a few people to success to know that I'm actually objectively good at this.

Ok fair enough, that is a vital addition you made.

What I have observed is the pattern of "she doesn't function" => "she needs to improve" => "she needs to let go". If you do provide coaching to a motivated person, I believe success is the most likely outcome.