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by ajross 1593 days ago
How about we measure and see if FSD is killing people at all first? It's not an unanswerable problem, after all. There are 60k+ of these devices on the roads now. If the statistics say it's unsafe, pull it and shut the program down.

Do they? If they don't, would you admit that it's probably a good thing to let it continue?
2 comments
ablekh 1593 days ago
You can't measure that without stopping all Beta testers' interventions, which implies allowing the system to actually kill people.
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ChuckNorris89 1593 days ago
>How about we measure and see if FSD is killing people at all first?

We just saw a FSD car run a red light and nearly hit pedestrians if the driver hadn't intervened.

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ajross 1593 days ago
Exactly. Let's measure. Is that rate higher than seen by median cars in the environment? I'd argue no, given how distressingly common that kind of incident is (certainly it's happened to me a bunch of times). But I'm willing to see data.

I think where you're going here is toward an assertion that "any failure at all is unacceptable". And that seems innumerate to me. Cars fail. We're trying to replace a system here that is already fatally (literally!) flawed. The bar is very low.

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ChuckNorris89 1593 days ago
>I think where you're going here is toward an assertion that "any failure at all is unacceptable". We're trying to replace a system here that is already fatally (literally!) flawed. The bar is very low.

Failure is not the issue when it comes to Tesla FSD, accountability is.

For any mistakes human drivers makes, they have to pay up with money, have their license suspended, or with jail time, depending on the severity of their mistake.

You fuck up, you pay the price. That's the contract under which human drivers are allowed on the road. Humans drivers are indeed flawed, but with our law and justice systems, we have accountability to keep those who break the law in check, while allowing freedom for those who respect it. It's one of the pillars of any civilized society.

In my country, running a stop sign or a red light means you get your license suspended for a while. When a self driving Tesla does the same mistake, why doesn't Tesla's FSD AI have its "license" suspended as well? That's the issue.

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