[chronogram]

Performance improvement plan. Either a manager writes a plan of measurable goals focused on improving, or a manager and the target employee both work on the plan together. It can be used for actual performance improvement or it can be used as something the employee cannot meet as a way to fire them or get them to a different team.

[MattGaiser]

You would be nuts to treat it as anything other than loading the bullet into the gun that terminates you. All it is is to make sure that the bullet is legal.

[1ef211383f1e92e]

You should try to consider it from the company's perspective as well-- hiring an engineer is very expensive, takes a long time, and any new engineer has takes time before they can start to fully contribute to a codebase.

If you're a manager in a situation where an employee has a problem and aren't meeting the job requirements, you'd probably much rather that they fix the problem and contribute to the team than fire them.

That doesn't mean that all of these plans are done in good faith, or that some managers aren't terrible. And for an employee on a PIP, they should think hard about leaving the company (or at least the team); it'll be better for their career.

But I don't think one can say that it's nothing more than a legal way to fire someone (especially since you can fire someone in most states in the US without cause, and spurious allegations of racial or other discrimination would need documentation that would be hard to produce if it didn't actually happen).

[rocqua]

Whilst I think you are right, being put on a PiP should still be seen as a big warning. Especially since there are many ways to help someone improve in performance. There is little need for formalization in a benign pip. The main reason a pip is formalized is to prepare for firing.

I don't think being put on a pip means firing is certain and imminent. I do think being put on a pip means firing is on the table and a serious threat. In that sense the analogy of 'putting a bullet in the chamber' is accurate if maybe a bit strong.

[0x002A]

Pip is to create document trail (so when they get sued they can show evidence ) and to force people into submission and resignation. So this way they can handle things quietly and dirty things kept undercover.

[Nextgrid]

> that they fix the problem and contribute to the team than fire them.

> And for an employee on a PIP, they should think hard about leaving the company (or at least the team); it'll be better for their career.

Considering both of these statements, a PIP is never the right answer if your objective is legitimate performance improvement.

Even if you're an unexperienced (or outright stupid) manager that doesn't understand this and wants to use a PIP as a legitimate performance improvement tool, the target employee is never going to be on good terms with you or your company and it's very unlikely you'll actually get the desired results. If you do, it's only because the employee has literally no choice but that loyalty will be out the window as soon as he is in a better position to make a move.

[MattGaiser]

Companies don't treat engineers as expensive to hire or difficult to hire in any other context (beyond complaining about it)), so I am extremely skeptical that they do here.

[pcthrowaway]

I think there are exceptions to this. At my last full-time role I was PIP-ed, and if I'm being completely honest, it wasn't undeserved. I had been burnt out for 2-3 years, had tried to quit 2 years prior but they offered me a 10% raise to stay

Honestly, I should have still quit, because it was burn-out over the role rather than compensation-related. But I stayed, and slacked a lot. Tracked my hours towards the end and I might get 12 actual hours of work done some weeks, including meetings. Still got most of my work done, but often with delays. It wasn't a perfect job, but the team was great and I liked the company culture.

My manager was very clear with me when I was PIPed that he really wanted us to work together to get me back on track. HR wouldn't consider letting me work part-time despite multiple conversations (it went against the company policy, and other people would start asking for it), but he tried to convince me to take paid time off instead. I decided to quit anyway, because I figured I was done spending most of my day configuring automated test pipelines and wanted to spend more time writing code that wasn't bash.

When I put in my notice, the manager tried to convince me to stay again, said they really wanted me just on track, and reiterated again that up to 4 months of paid leave was an option. Seemed really forlorn about the situation during the exit interview.

I honestly believe I could have worked my way out of the PIP, and the management would have preferred that outcome. Employing me at my current level of performance wasn't delivering the value they were paying for though, and quitting was ultimately the best situation for everyone involved.

[sofixa]

I don't get this. From what I've heard, in the US, you don't need an excuse to fire anyone. Why bother documenting an excuse then?

[chronogram]

While the US has been traditionally fire at will, over the latter half of the 20th century exceptions had to be made where you can’t fire people for various discriminatory things or becoming a parent anymore. In the early 20th century organisations also couldn’t fire people for unionizing anymore. And not all unions accept fire at will policy.

Companies may additionally prefer to have more standardized procedures. Hiring is expensive, training is expensive, and cohesion can only be gained over a long time. By needing multiple steps to fire someone you reduce the chance you throw the baby out with the bathwater. And even if you’re sure someone is a negative factor and want to fire them with little prior notice, the people who you think are good are not mind readers and might even have a different opinion of their colleague and will question their own employment security.

[cerved]

I suspect it's partially a way to protect from lawsuits so it's difficult to file a suit you were fired for idk, your religious views, refusing romantic advances, refused to do something illegal etc. etc.

[joncrane]

Generally speaking, someone on a PIP is not eligible to move to another team, so the sole reason is to fire the person.