[xwdv]

“Gifted” individuals are selected at early ages to run through rigorous education programs that greatly push them ahead of their peers. It is a pipeline to create intellectual elites and captains of industry. Gifted kids are widely accepted as the most intelligent kids of a school and held up as the finest examples of the school’s educational abilities.

[myself248]

Wow, that's a warped description if I ever heard one. I always felt like "gifted" was a label given to kids who were out-of-place in a normal classroom, to justify having special education so they were less likely to disrupt class or kill themselves out of boredom.

[ukyrgf]

Hm, for me it meant I mostly stuck with the same student peer group throughout grade school, I think we got to skip some standardizes tests, and I was able to get a school bus to the bigger schools even though I was way out in the sticks. I had to go through an aptitude test and even though I was only like 7 I still remember sitting in the car after and being mad at myself for missing a question about "another word for water" being H20.

[emteycz]

Yours is the warped one. Gifted student programs are very common, and while they are sometimes used for what you say, it's not the designated purpose.

[more_corn]

However, there doesn't seem to be a correlation between membership in gifted programs and success later in life.

[bitexploder]

Do kids in gifted programs go on to become intellectual elites and “captains of industry” at higher rates than their peers?

[brimble]

Not by much, I'd bet. If at all.

The poster seems to have confused top-tier private schools and gifted programs. Read enough politician and C-suite and such bios and it's very clear what's going on. You practically never see "attended a pretty decent public high school—but was in the gifted program!" Private college prep secondary schools (at the very least—often it's private schools all the way) on the other hand are overwhelmingly the norm in that set.

It's kinda depressing as a parent. If you haven't scraped together 25+k/yr for elite prep school tuition (and, probably, boarding) all your "you can be anything you want if you try really hard!" is kinda a lie. Like, that's still much better than not trying hard and will likely improve your life outcomes, but, looking at the actual world, realistically... nah, sorry, you're probably locked out of a lot of options. There are de facto requirements, and we couldn't afford them. Sorry kid.

Similar story with The Arts. You start looking at the backgrounds of very high-paid artists of all kinds (actors, musicians, even authors a lot of the time if they're considered good and not "merely" popular) and you're likely screwed if you weren't at least one of: 1) born to a family that's already successful at that, or 2) had an expensive and very focused education starting before college. Lots of the successful folks had both of those things. Again: there are counter examples, and it's technically possible to get in if your parents weren't in the arts and you didn't start gigging/acting/attending-an-artsy-private-school by the time you were 12, but realistically you're looking at a serious uphill battle.

[lemarchr]

> Private college prep secondary schools (at the very least—often it's private schools all the way) on the other hand are overwhelmingly the norm in that set.

To which data set are you referring? Data from 2019 found that 80% of Fortune 100 CEOs hold undergraduate degrees from public institutions[0].

[0]: https://www.forbes.com/sites/kimberlywhitler/2019/09/07/a-ne...

[visarga]

I think in most cases supporting kids with money and professional experience is family merit. The family spent money and effort to help its next generation. Maybe they are not rich, just education focused and ready to sacrifice a lot to achieve it. On the other hand having too much family wealth correlates negatively with academic accomplishments.

The complexity of art and math doesn't change depending on how you learn or how rich is your father. Even with support a kid has to gain the same useful skills. What matters is ability, not how the kid got there. They are just kids, everything that shaped society into what it is happened before they were grown enough to have any say in it.

[icedchai]

I was in the 80's gifted program in elementary school (for grades 3 through 6), but went to private schools for jr high and high school. I learned more from public gifted education.

FYI, $25K/year won't get you an elite prep school these days. For that, you'll need at least $60K+.

[didericis]

Good question. The programs themselves are generally good, as far as I’ve experienced, but the culture around them is often quite toxic. Many kids are treated like race horses. I’m not sure how effective they are on net. Most highly successful people seem like autodidacts that end up finding the resources they need one way or another. Would guess the best way to create more of those people is just to keep a lot of doors open and hope someone like that walks through.

[DarylZero]

Culture overrun by rich overachievers gaming the selection system?

[didericis]

That’s a fairly blunt description, but I think it’s roughly accurate. I think there are plenty of middle income and low income overachievers in there as well. Recent immigrants can be incredibly demanding and hard on kids who might not be naturally inclined to pursue that kind of thing without external pressure, as can competitive suburbanites.

But by trying to mitigate the risk of toxicity you can go too far in the other direction and end up not pushing smart kids to reach their full potential, which is also bad. Striking the right balance is hard.

[officeplant]

I was put through through multiple gifted programs in both middle school and high school (Southern US). I loved the challenging course work from dealing with college level science classes as early as the 7th grade. The main problem with gifted programs is it really makes normal public schooling extra miserable once you are back with the general population. Uncaring teachers, scantron tests, and large classes sizes left me depressed with schooling quality.

Once I got to college after graduating from a boarding school for gifted teens it was like a culture shock back to the world of horrible professors. I nearly failed out of college due to being completely uninterested with the lack of engaging materials in first semester classes.

Ended up with a degree in broadcast journalism because it was an easy path to graduating in less than 3 years. Especially because I was graduating during the 2008 financial crisis and just wanted to be done with school and find whatever job I could to get a start in the real world.

It's a nice piece of paper for HR to nod at and let me pass the degree hurdle.

My favorite moment was working a shit retail job in 2010 and running into another graduate of the same gifted high school working a fast food job just to survive.

EDIT// I did have some classmates go to found companies, work for NASA, etc. They were driven people who could have prospered in any scenario honestly.

[Cthulhu_]

Nope, it's a dick shaking title that can give kids issues in life.

Someone I know was called gifted at some point, he didn't end up in any accelerated programs but he did end up in higher education... which he only finished after many years, meanwhile he was eating, drinking and smoking his student loans + job income away, he ended up broke and in debt, and to date - 10, 15 years later - is still unemployed.

[egypturnash]

Anecdotes are not data, but I was in the Gifted And Talented program in high school and I sure did not become either of those. I'm eking out a living as an obscure freelance artist. A lot of my friends are former G/T kids who did not live up to their supposed promise, too.

It got me some interesting opportunities here and there but I am fundamentally kind of a slacker :)

[itbeho]

This one didn't:)

[pnutjam]

haha... no, but their parents feel special. NY public schools used their gifted program as a way to keep white kids in majority non-white schools.