[germandiago]

I am not asking to be provided services I do not pay for.

I am not claiming I should have roads and health care and all and that taxes are theft at the same time. I am saying that taxes are theft on the basis that noone asked me what to pay or not.

The proof that things are terribly managed, at least in my country (Spain), is that we have a 120% GDP debt.

We are making new-born be born with a debt. Is that the right thing to do? For me that is immoral, unless you are that kind of person that thinks that we do a default and done, which would mean you are not a person that has a word to be believed. So what are the alternatives?

[HWR_14]

If you, or the newborn, leave Spain and renounce your citizenship they're not going to assign you a percentage of the national debt. Feel free to move to Somalia and pay no taxes and not be responsible for the national debt.

[germandiago]

You can go to Somalia, it is not the place I want to be in but you seem to be obsessed about Somalia.

I will give you some clues: Taiwan, Singapore, Cyprus (Greek part, of course), Estonia, Georgia, South Korea, Switzerland: and probably also many of the places you call a tax haven.

You can go to Somalia if you feel like.

[HWR_14]

I don't care where you go. But here's a hint, your list has income tax rates of 40%, 22%, 35%, 20%, 45% and (depends on the canon and city) 30% (in Geneva) respectively. That's plus any property, sales, VAT etc. taxes. I say go to Somalia because it's the only country that, AFAIK, has anything close to 0% taxation.

[germandiago]

Since you are talking about highest rate in Spain you have 54% Personal income + 21% VAT + anything you inherit or donate taxed + IBI (if you own a house). and do not get me started on business, or freelancing. Because they smash you badly.

In Spain if you earn 60,000 euros, which is not so much, in my area they tax you 47% from your salary + what your employer already paid to the social security. At the same rime they are raising the retirement age and do all kind of sh*t bc we have a Poncy system for retirement. Of course, politicians get max retirement after 8 years (for normal people it is 30 I recall). Some of them, like ex-presidents, have an income for the rest of their lives.

But hey, the money is to build roads and pay retirements and health care. Please someone explain to me this is not theft because I really do not get it.

The difference with a country like Singapore, with all its bad things (I lived there before, among other places) is that the level of corruption is lower, the taxing lower and the budget is managed seriously. Here... this is not even funny.

[HWR_14]

Why are you still in Spain then? You can move to Cyprus tomorrow, legally. Then you'll pay 20% less on your tax bill.

[germandiago]

I am moving somewhere else. But I am.

[germandiago]

what makes you think I should be expelled from the place I live just because I think making people be born in debt is bad? I am a second-class person in my own natural place?

[germandiago]

That is what I am in the process of doing.