Ask HN: Which software jobs involve time outdoors?

[danieloj]

Are there any software jobs where spending time outside is part of the job?

Having worked at home in my bedroom for the last couple of years I'm beginning to feel particularly claustrophobic being sat inside all day long!

Examples I can think of:

  - Outdoor robotics engineers
  - Wildlife monitoring
  - ...and that's about it

[theduemmer]

PLC programming is quite different than traditional programming but is still mentally challenging and could easily involve time outdoors. Take a refinery for example, lots of the equipment and instrumentation you'd be programming is located outside. Even if you worked on e.g. production lines totally indoors, the production floor is very different from offices!

I work in industrial automation and I love how hands on it is. I'd recommend to any SWE who is bored being cooped up in an office and isn't afraid to get a little dirty. Feel free to reach out to me if you'd liketo know more.

[Nextgrid]

I'd be interested to know more especially around how to break into the industry and if there are any online resources to learn the trade ahead of time.

[theduemmer]

In my opinion the best way to learn this stuff on your own would be to build and program a simple automation system. That could be, for example, a garage door system, pool controller, home brewing system, or even just a trainer with some buttons, indicators, sensors and motors.

You'd need basic electrical tools like a multimeter, control screwdrivers and wire strippers.

You would also need common hardware parts like terminals, din rail, 24v power supply and an enclosure. Maybe even some pneumatics if you're willing to spend more. And of course a PLC. If in North America, get a used Allen-Bradley micrologix or similar from ebay. If in Europe, Siemens s7-1200 would be better. You could also get another brand like Automation Direct Click, though that isn't used in industry as much as the two aforementioned industry standards. You'll also need the programming environments for each respective brand. AB has Connected Components Workbench, Siemens has TIA Portal, and AD Click has its own free to download environment.

You can find lots of wiring guides online for how to connect the basics together, it is pretty simple. If you could get your hands on Autocad or similar drafting program (there are free ones) and make electrical prints for your design that would be great to show in an interview. You'll need to be able to read, understand and possibly make your own prints on the job.

Programming PLCs is a different beast than traditional application programming. The most common language is Ladder Logic, which is a graphical representation of digital logic circuits that resemble relay logic wiring diagrams. There is also Structured Text, which is more like traditional text based programming, but in my experience it isn't nearly as popular in the field.

If you get into SCADA systems like Ignition (they have a free or cheap hobbyist package) you'll see more VBA or python scripting along with SQL and things like that. The industry is also being dragged kicking and screaming into the modern age where everything is increasingly networked together, and a little more thought is needed than putting everything on 192.168.1/24 on an open and unsecured network. Understanding networking and security would be a big advantage.

The programming itself is "simple"; constructs like for loops are considered advanced that an inexperienced engineer can do without, and one could have a fulfilling career without ever encountering a sorting algorithm. The challenge is that it isn't just programming, but mechanical, hydraulic, electrical and pneumatic systems that have their own host of challenges. A big could be caused by a programming issue, but it could also be something like a stuck valve, loose wire, or siezed bearing to name a few.

The best way to actually break in and learn would be to get comfortable with the basics and if possible get a job involving travel. Many jobs in the field require extended periods of travel to different plants, not a lot of people want to do that. And I get it, the travel can be brutal. I was just on an especially rough startup in another part of the country, and I pulled over 3 80 hour weeks in a row. I'm young, single and trying to learn so that doesn't bother me, but ymmv. There are plenty of jobs where you'd only be working in one plant, or several within an hour or two of home base. I can say that I learn way more in the field than designing stuff in the office though.

Last but not least, check out r/PLC. Those folks are great.

[danieloj]

That's incredibly helpful and insightful, thank you!

[nicbou]

I run a content-based website. It doesn't involve working outside, but it does involve working less, and from anywhere. A lot of my work can be done in a pub with a tablet.

Last year, it often meant working according to weather patterns, so that I could be outside on sunny days.

This might be an alternative way to achieve your goal.

[Phithagoras]

Most jobs that are performed outdoors do not involve the level of programming skill that you can provide. Nor would the type of programming likely be that engaging for you (at least on its own). They would also likely require a lot of skills that a CS degree/code camp never prepared you for. If your goal is to not be cooped up then go code on your porch, or in a park. Making a career out of working outdoors would probably require a career change out of straight software. Likely into a labour/trades/technician role. These have rather different challenges.

Land surveyors have to know some basic programming, but their main skillset is knowing how to survey, and being willing to walk around with their equipment all day.

Wildlife monitoring and Remote Sensing and GIS tend to be.... remote. Usually the equipment is satellite or set up by a park warden/summer student who doesnt have strong programming skills. They might call a contractor if they're having problems with it.

Industrial automation requires a fair bit of mechanics, circuits, hydraulics, pneumatics, a bit of basic programming and a strong aptitude for physically putting things together/taking apart (especially in freezing mud).

Geology can split either way, supervising drilling can mean lots of time in a tent staring at drill core as you write the core log report on computer but you might also end up in an office downtown doing oil flow modelling based on the log, or writing a financial report based on the model. (or a mix). Same with mine engineers, petroleum engineers, civil engineers.

Lots of these jobs are 12 hrs a day, 10 on 10 off or 14/14. You go to cool places but the downside is that you gotta go even if you dont want to. Your wife is due to have your first kid next week? Sucks that you got a two week shift starting tomorrow. Quick 1 day job a few hours drive from town? When an unmapped gas line gets hit it'll be week long fiasco of overtime hell. Sent to an offshore rig near Newfoundland? Get stuck there and miss all your other flights as helicopters are grounded by a metre of snow overnight!

Field jobs are exciting and interesting stuff is always happening, but its usually not good news. If you're feeling cooped up but overall enjoy software, try working from outside your house! If you're looking to change careers, becoming a Professional Engineer could be the move. Its not a short path though, and then you're responsible when things go wrong

[gadders]

Get a setup like Stephen Wolfram, and any software job can be an outside job: https://writings.stephenwolfram.com/2019/02/seeking-the-prod...

[danieloj]

Ha I’ve considered that. I think I’d like a job that is directly connected to the physical environment rather than me just being in that environment (i.e I want to see my code change something in front of me)

[saargrin]

Oil platform IoT stuff

in general security sensitive environments and everything to do with tier-1 support for military hardware

though you might end up marooned in barracks on an airfield in Angola or something,not sure if that counts as "outdoors"

[nnadams]

I spent a good amount of time outside when I worked for an automotive company. And just a lot of time being active in general. Technically I was just a software engineer, but I was in a department of mostly mechanical engineers.

My days were split up by small things to do like go pickup a vehicle from a coworker. Go to the test track to collect data. Help another engineer debug a vehicle. Review functionality of a prototype with a mechanic. Etc.

On paper all that sounds a bit annoying, and it was some days. After changing jobs and working fully remote with covid though, I do miss having a reason to get up.

[ssss11]

I think there would be some swe that would occasionally need to go to timber mills, mines, sea ports, air ports, oil rigs , farms etc… prob to install or troubleshoot critical systems. I doubt it would be often though.

[danieloj]

That’s interesting. Maybe some systems are so remote they might need full time software engs nearby. Although I probably wouldn’t want to live that remotely

[codingdave]

Based on my experience, it is the actual mechanical/electrical/etc. engineers who troubleshoot in the field. Someone who is pure software still sits in the office.

If you really want to be outdoors, that would be my recommendation - skill up as a licensed engineer.

[ssss11]

Yep actually when I did infrastructure work at a timber mill I’d come by once per month but the electrical engineer was the day to day IT guy.

For really remote mines (fly in fly out) an infra guy would go install the network and weighbridge systems with the swe on the phone or via email for any issues, but then he wouldn’t go out there again unless there was catastrophe - everything was managed remotely.

I’m sure there’s other companies or industries that may do it differently though.

[dbi]

Welllll doordash is brining back "wedash" [0] which means all empolyees need to complete at least one food delivery a month if that's what you mean.

[0] https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/food/2021/12/29/doordas...

[ultrasounder]

Not outdoors but post COVID if you are keen on sweaty, grimy, grubby Foxconn/HonHai factories, mystery meat delivered for lunch then any name brands consumer electronics(MAAGA-Netflix is out of the question) that makes doodahs is fair game. Typically these companies hire for roles such as software engineer(embedded/manufacturing/test). I did this once and probably not going to do it again.

[f0e4c2f7]

Work from home on the back deck.

[nateb2022]

Get a remote job, and travel the world while you work. As long as you have a decent satellite modem, you should be able to get a decent signal even from the Alps. Camp on the Sierra Nevada while refactoring code, or climb the Andes in between performance reviews.

[neverartful]

I can relate to the desire for being outdoors as much as possible. However, I think it's important to remember that sometimes the weather outside can be brutal or miserable and at those times it's nice to not be required to be outside.

[fer]

IoT, of course there's a lot of indoor development, but for example most LoRa/LoRaWAN use cases would require field tests.

[danieloj]

Funnily enough my current company has a big IoT network and I was hoping this would mean I would get to travel to the installation sites but the tooling is so good everything can be done remotely! I imagine other companies must have more people on site though

[toomuchtodo]

https://www.usap.gov/

[vgeek]

Could some type of GIS role adjacent to civil engineering provide opportunities to venture outside?