[dagmx]

Film development is actually quite a bit more subjective. There's a much larger variance in film type, and the chemical process.

Perhaps it's harder to doctor, but it's also not necessarily truer either.

With regards to sensor size and detail recorded...well that depends. Are you assuming 35mm sensors? Because people shot 8mm and 16mm too back in the day. That's not far off from smaller sensors today. Are we also accounting for film sensitivity? Because digital sensors have far eclipsed the sensitivity range of most common film types now, so would be more likely to resolve image data.

It's not so cut and dry.

[tagoregrtst]

Sensitivity of digital is amazing. You cant really get past ISO 400 on film without large compromises.

But, as for size, photo cameras sporting film smaller than 35 were rare. Yes Kodak had the advantax (?) system and some other weird cameras here and there, but the vast majority of consumer pictures were taken on 35mm.

As to the subjectivity of film, as I mentioned in the other post, most of the subjectivity came from what I called the “z” dimension, i.e exposure. There was little subjectivity about the enlargement itself.

That is to say, the subjectivity was largely limited to the contrast and brightness sliders of today. Anything else is far more difficult to do with film.

There is another advantage for digital, cost. Video was much more rare with film, and the video we’re talking about certainly would not exist.

But I think that’s the greatest advantage of film - it contains within it an inherent protection of the public’s privacy completely absent in our society today

[dagmx]

Specifically, this thread originated with the Kyle Rittenhouse trial which would be video. So for the average person, it would be 8/16mm.

Even for stills, 110/126 was very common.

As for your last point, it only ensured privacy from the poor. Privacy was always invaded by those with means like paparazzi.

There's also the flip side that the prevalence of digital has let people capture pivotal moments they wouldn't have been able to otherwise, including generation defining moments like the murder of George Floyd.

[tagoregrtst]

Privacy for the poor, not from. Paparazzi have never been outside my door. They were taking pictures of rich people for gossip mags (ie poor consumers).

Now we spy on poor people, use AI to analyze the photos at scale, while the rich got anti-paparazzi laws put in places like EU and CA.

In this context, the Rittenhouse video would not exist and it would be better if it didn't. The prosecution, arguably, should get disbarred for the shenanigans they pulled (no discovery and dumping it in the last moment, giving a modified version, lying about the provenance).

As to George Floyd, cameras have done much more to erode our civil liberties than they have put bad cops away.

[dagmx]

No, not privacy for the poor, but from the poor. You'd still have rich travellers visiting poor countries and taking photos of the locals like they're some roadside attraction.

Rich people and people in power have been able to invade our privacy whenever they wanted.

Making everyone capable of having digital cameras has enabled so much. With regards to cops, it's let the general public document and share examples of police brutality, in ways that would never have been possible before.

I think it's clear from your comment where your political biases lie and what your ethnicity bias likely is. You may subsequently argue that it's irrelevant, but you're also not walking in our shoes as minorities. Cameras have been a huge boon to being able to share our plight.

Emmett Till was a profound moment in Black history because his image could be shared in person with others. Similarly George Floyd, Ahmaud Arbery etc were defining because the cameras were there...

[djrogers]

> But, as for size, photo cameras sporting film smaller than 35 were rare.

Strong disagree here. 126 film is what brought color photography to the mass market, and others like the Kodak Disc were wildly popular among point-n-shoot users.

35mm was standard for pro photogs, but consumers went for convenience.

[djrogers]

I should also point out that while 126 popularized color photography, a decade later 110 came along and largely dominated consumer photography until the digital revolution.

[tagoregrtst]

126? 110 (other comment)? By that token betamax was a successful format in 1975 before VHS launched.

35mm was the top selling film since the 1960s until digital took over.

You went to any drugstore and you found 35mm. Maybe a box or two of APS. Maybe some medium format. But you could find 35mm in every drugstore, gas station, street vendor in a tourist trap without fail.

Professionals used 35mm because it was snaller than MF and for many things good enough. Otherwise it was considered consumer grade.