[vmception]

Perfect, now we've moved to pragmatic criticism of the current state of NFTs that have nothing to do with the concept of NFTs.

(Non NFT tickets fluctuate wildly in price. Transaction fees on almost all chains are extremely low as gas is negligible in cost, with Ethereum mainnet being an exception.)

So we have less revocable or irrevocable digital goods that are tradable, scarce per collection that provably predates any subsequent issuance, tertiary benefits to physical and digital access, and membership. Even if this technology only was considered to do any of each of those things moderately well, instead of replacing any incumbent implementation, you still have trouble with .... what exactly? We've now agreed that each one is a single asset that does many things at least decently well without any custom implementation needed to be built even if the existing ONE thing in each category has an okay incumbent, and you get a fun picture to go with it. Yes, to some people that has aggregate value.

What are you still having trouble with at this point:

-Whether you should ever own/possess one?

-Whether you should ever use money to own/possess one?

-Something about speculation being bad?

-Something about not knowing if the market will still be there for resell and wondering if that would make everyone else leave the NFT space?

It seems like cognitive dissonance to me, since some of these ideas compete with each other.

[blueski]

> pragmatic criticism of the current state of NFTs that have nothing to do with the concept of NFTs.

Which NFTs include a central authority able to re-issue my ticket if I lose it, address mis-representation by sellers, give refunds if the performance doesn't happen, etc? Isn't that lack of a central authority - and its attendant downsides - core to the medium?

> Non NFT tickets fluctuate wildly in price.

Which non NFT tickets have fluctuated like Bored Ape NFTs this year, and which are highly susceptible to market sentiment for the entire ticketing medium?

> What are you still having trouble with at this point:

Trying to understand how many people I respect have such enthusiasm for a medium which appears to have many downsides vs the status quo - and not yet a killer app like e.g. Gmail, Maps, Facebook to justify the Web2->Web3 transition. No doubt I'm missing something, just trying to understand what.

There's been enthusiasm for smart contracts for 5+ years, but which mainstream consumer or B2B apps have yet implemented them for non-speculation use cases?

How would it be progress for the New York Times to restrict access to quality journalism - or for Soho House to expose its future cash flows to extreme market volatility?

[vmception]

Plenty of NFT projects have issued refunds directly to current holders. It's just a management decision and wouldn't really make the news.

Many festivals have direct sales for a few hundred dollars, resold for a few thousand before the festival occurs and the ticket is redeemed. Similar price moves are much more common in the NFT space than a move to a Bored Ape amount ($200,000 at time of writing). If several hundred percent isn't considered volatile enough for comparison, that really discredits the good faith efforts of this conversation.

> but which mainstream consumer or B2B apps have yet implemented them for non-speculation use cases?

Its crypto and everything else. At this point you can stop looking. If you are doing a crypto app and trying to make a sales process and funnel for people not in the crypto space, then you're wasting your time. There are already 2-3 trillion dollars of value in the space and high volume onchain and offchain. Many people are providing financial services to speculators, just like people that provide ... financial services to speculators in the rest of the economy. People extract value by making some other aspect of the ecosystem easier for other people.

> How would it be progress for the New York Times to restrict access to quality journalism - or for Soho House to expose its future cash flows to extreme market volatility?

The question is how much would the owners pay for that access. Not whether it is a viable business model the issuer gambled on. There are plenty of NFT projects that didn't get enough resales for that half-year-old model to be seen as viable for royalties or the community. Some are actively traded enough that it doesn't turn out to be a rip off. Guess who still earned all the money from the original sale but only talked about what they might do with royalties from after market sales, so the question is always "whose problem is it".

People are enthused because they get to experiment. Just move a function around, alter one variable in a class and viola' the hit of the week and $24,000,000[1] that people are very appreciative of. Maybe they've done something sustainable maybe not. People want to participate for whats possible. The prices from the original issuer are moderate/predictable or even free, the stuff that makes the headlines is just all enthused people that need to make their own objective decisions.

[1] https://www.adidas.com/into_the_metaverse/mint here Adidas is embracing that people like to buy and resell their merchandise, frequently at massive premiums, so they are only letting NFT holders authenticate to purchase for a specific future drop instead. They were about $800 each and they sold 30,000 of them. A merch flipper can price their own potential future revenues accordingly, or just be an actual collector first in line to collect the merchandise. Each experiment is different, available to be debated in isolation, it is impossible to use a broad brush because the word NFT is involved. Obviously someone is free to put one of these on their twitter avatar, it should be obvious that this won't help them with access to the Adidas drops. "Oh my god speculation I knewwww it, bot infested free for alls were so adequate", just a strawman for some fun (or is it), we can laugh