[kenjackson]

The people who refuse vaccines don't do it for a really strong principled reason, AFAICT. I think they compartmentalize vaccines and the industry that makes them completely distinct from the rest of the pharma industry. Even more than that they view the Covid vaccine differently than flu or any other vaccine - largely for political reasons.

[throwawayboise]

I think people who refuse or are reluctant to be vaccinated do it for a variety of reasons. Some (I think a minority) are some degree of conspiracy nuts who think it's all a plot to reduce population and enable government mind control via altered DNA, etc.

Some don't trust that the speed of the process as well as the immense political pressure to "do something" really sussed out the true effectiveness, safety, and immunity conferred by the vaccines, noting that coronaviruses have never had successful vaccines before now, as they mutate too rapidly.

I'm in the second camp. I viewed the situation as entirely different from traditional, well studied vaccines for endemic diseases such as measles, mumps, etc. I eventually did get vaccinated as I was under threat to lose my job if I didn't. I didn't want it otherwise, and time has shown that they aren't nearly as effective as initially promised. Most of the initial promises that the vaccines were the key to ending the pandemic have turned out to be wrong, the only thing we can really now say is that they offer some (short-term?) protection to the recipient, and at least in the case of the Janssen/J&J vaccine they are not as safe as promised either.

I will add that I don't like doctors, and I'm not a pill-popper. I don't take medicines that I don't need. I would be loathe to take any long-term prescription meds for any reason. Short term courses of antibiotics I will use. Other OTC very sparingly. I don't think I've taken more than a few Advils in the past 5 years, and that was when I had a tooth extracted.

[jmull]

> Some don't trust that the speed of the process as well as the immense political pressure to "do something" really sussed out the true… [etc]

This is your “second camp” but I don’t see how this isn’t another form of conspiracy nut. You’ve just got a suspicion that things aren’t right and are fact-fitting to that. If you’re measuring risks, there’s no comparison between Unvaccinated vs. Vaccinated.

[pcan77]

I honestly think you severely underestimate the amount of people not taking it due to being conspiracy nuts.

I never thought I'd know ANYONE like this, but now almost every antivaxxer I know has some crackpot insanity reason for not getting vaccinated. None of them are worried about safety, FDA approval, etc. Hell my FIL thinks COVID-19 was meant to bring the endtimes so Jesus will come back and the rapture will happen. So do ALL of his constituents of his Church more or less.

So let's not mitigate the crackpots to a "minority" because it's simply not true.

[arghnoname]

One problem here is there are two camps in the vaccine resistant group:

1. Those who did not want to take the vaccine but did

2. Those who will not take the vaccine under nearly any condition

With many people's jobs being threatened and ability to eat in restaurants, etc being limited, most unvaxxed are in the second camp. At this stage I'd say they must have very strong feelings on it and are more likely to think the vaccine is much more dangerous than the data suggests or has some other nefarious purpose.

I'm vaccinated and I did it voluntarily as it seemed like it met the risk/reward trade-off for me. I've always been against mandates. I probably won't take the current booster unless forced (more of the same for a very different and likely mild variant meet my cost/benefit threshold), but I will take it if my job hinges on it. Rational people weigh cost/benefit. Losing your job definitely tilts the ledger, but I imagine many people who felt coerced into their decision are pretty sore over it and we will suffer some serious political repercussions for this, in my view, unnecessary mandate.

[coolso]

> The people who refuse vaccines don't do it for a really strong principled reason, AFAICT.

I am very often around circles of people who haven't been vaccinated: family members, friends, friends of family members, friends of friends, etc. There's a good mix between political reasons, and principled reasons. Most fall into the latter group, including myself: I refused to get the vaccine until it was in general availability for at least 6 months. This was the time period I felt comfortable with where I figured if any issues were to arise, we'd have found out about it by then.

Others have longer personal time frames. Others don't want to get it at all. But usually, it is for a strong principled reason. The fact of the matter is, past vaccines have caused issues; vaccines are not without their risks. Do the benefits outweigh the risks? Absolutely! But it's a personal choice. At this point, with all the data we've seen with how harmless and beneficial they are, I believe it to be an unwise one to not get vaxxed, but it's a personal choice nonetheless.

> Even more than that they view the Covid vaccine differently than flu or any other vaccine - largely for political reasons.

But, in fact, the COVID vaccine is very different than any other vaccine. Not only is it brand new technology that to this point was a failure in other trials with other diseases, it was also fast-tracked and released far sooner than any other in history. And it is for a virus that largely most severely affects the elderly, obese, and those with preexisting conditions.

People also forget that the very news organizations and politicians pretentiously shaming people for not getting vaccinated today, are the very same news organizations and politicians that spread fear and doubt about the vaccine just prior to the election. [0] Our current president did the same thing.

Perhaps if they didn't politicize it in the first place, or even plant seeds of fear...they would have more of a leg to stand on when it comes to being so divisive about the matter.

[0]: https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/01/health/eua-coronavirus-vaccin...

[guerrilla]

Some do, some don't. I know two anti-vaxxers and one of them takes medication for mental illness and the other doesn't trust any doctors for any reason but does all kinds of homeopathy and other psuedoscientific shit.