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by RangerScience 1647 days ago
> something like

Yeah, that's correct. And IMHO, if Damore had presented just that, I would expect the outcome to be different, although still fraught for other reasons. But he didn't present just that.

> questions

You did end up answering them, although in a different chain! And I appreciate it.

> disagreement

I mean, bluntly, I'm pretty much ready to abandon it, although since others are engaging seems like you're good to go without me :)

> conversation

One issue that seems to come up in these situations - not always, and I don't really know one way the other if it came up in Damore's - was recently demonstrated by Dave Chappelle, when he went to his alma mater saying (paraphrased) "let's have a conversation", and then (IMO) very much didn't, even if people said words to each other. So that happens.

> you and others

So... Like. To the extent that I've invited you to a conversation, that we're then having here - do you feel like we're having a conversation, or do you feel like there's more heretic burning?

1 comments

"Heretic burning" is, obviously, pretty hyperbolic. Nobody is actually being burnt. But, people's (i.e. Damore's) reputations are getting damaged. Other readers have reinforced for them the fact that if you question diversity orthodoxy you will be vilified and fired. I very much think your comments are in that vein - you started with explaining that Damore's memo "was a moderately anti-diversity screed".

Damore's memo was not an anti-diversity screed and I don't believe any reasonable reader could reach that conclusion. As such, I view your comments not as participating in conversation but as a warning light to passersby that they will suffer enduring reputational damage should they express the wrong opinions - a reminder that even if your positions are evidence based, measured, and appropriately expressed you will still face the destruction of your career and reputation for expressing those ideas.

I'm sticking to my theory that much of what made Damore's document problematic - or problematic enough to warrant what happened - was due to, essentially, tone.

Maybe I am naïve, but I do strongly believe that it is completely possible to express non-orthodox positions in a way that doesn't prompt that kind of backlash. (And to put my money at least somewhat where my mouth is, I'll totally workshop something with anyone reading this if they're wanting to express such a position.)

Going back to OP, if I rephrase "k-complicity" as "don't challenge people with lethal power; instead be silent", then this all becomes "don't talk normally to people about sensitive things; instead be exceptionally kind."

I continue to think this is not a reasonable reading of Damore's document. There is absolutely nothing wrong or unprofessional about Damore's tone.