[DerArzt]

I am sort of with you on the whole:

> But I'm a developer by heart and my heart aches whenever I see what we devs have wrought in the ops space.

At the same time, I am conflicted. I don't care for the toss-it-over-the-wall approach that used to be the norm, but I also don't like having dev's have to take more on than they are capable.

In an ideal environment, I would like to see a crashing together of developers and operations people on teams. What I mean is that for a given team you have several developers and one or two ops folks. This way there is less of an us vs them sentiment and teams can be held accountable for their solutions from ideation to running in production. Finally while it's not the sole responsibility of the dev's to manage their DevOps stuff, they will have more knowledge of how it works, and get to put input and ideas to it.

[geekbird]

This was the original intent of DevOps - a cultural shift that put sysadmins/ops people into the dev team, thus have a better feedback loop between dev and prod, and tear down the wall between dev and ops. But now it's being used as a way to eliminate ops people and push it all into dev.