[friedman23]

> pretend play is the ultimate game but good luck finding a willing player over 12.

What do you think improv is? And pen and paper RPGs are a form of improv constrained by some rules. But those rules are what people agree for them to be and you can make them as restrictive or as loose as you can agree to.

[willis936]

My point is that taking it to the extreme then stopping at tabletop as the natural best is nonsense. Tabletop has rules. If rules are the enemy then tabletop is not the ultimate. People enjoy frameworks. On one end of the spectrum is pretend play and on the other is a movie theatre. What spectrum of interactive entertainment you want to participate in is purely subjective and one is not "better" than another. Having fewer limits is not a virtue. It is worth nothing.

[tormeh]

Most TTRPG groups ignore rules. The DM almost always fudges things behind the scenes and rule-of-cools stuff. The only rules in TTRPGs are what the DM decides. The books are just guidelines.

[tsimionescu]

I think tabletop came up here because it's the origin of Cyberpunk 2077, not because it is somehow the ultimate form of interactive entertainment. That last line is just claiming that Cyberpunk 2077 ultimately worked better as a tabletop game than a video game.

Mind you, I don't necessarily agree, but I also don't think it's such a grandiose claim.