[ac130kz]

Nah, Django makes you sad: async support is not full, migrations engine is pretty poor, not all database features are present, any kind of typing is hacky, very slow and so on

[qeternity]

> migrations engine is pretty poor

I find this to be an odd take. The Django migrations engine is probably its strongest feature.

[ac130kz]

Any change you make has to be atomic, or it is unable to detect the change, and you have to rely on manual migrations.

[WD-42]

What do you mean by this? Auto migrations detect changes in your models. I'm not sure what atomic means in this context.

[ac130kz]

Let's say you change some attribute and the name of a model, Django simply does not recognize it, nuking the whole attribute

[wiredfool]

There is at least one way that migrating a + b is different than migrate a + migrate b, in ways that you can then only incrementally migrate your project rather than building from scratch.

It’s mainly in post migrate actions, and specifically for me adding a group for permissions.

[WD-42]

If you write manual migrations, then it's often worth it to write the reverse function (in your case, deleting that group) so that you avoid this situation.

[wiredfool]

It’s not the back and forth, it’s that a migration in b that requires the post migrate step from a will fail if both migrations are run in one shot, (say, because you’re bootstrapping a new dev or test db) but it will work when done incrementally (such as during development or deployment).

[geewee]

What other migration engine have you used that's better? Anything non-django I've used makes me wish I was using Django

[fb03]

"alembic" is better by leaps and bounds. it is used within a SQLAlchemy system, which is also a superior ORM than Django's.

[louissan]

question of taste...

[robertlagrant]

Less taste and more that data mapper ORMs are better (although harder to make) than active record ones, except for very small datasets/simple queries.

[andybak]

"Better" for whom? It was a long time ago that I surveyed the ORM landscape but I remember thinking at the time I was much happier using an active record style ORM.

I guess I'm saying I'm always suspicious when I see "better" with no qualification. Everything has tradeoffs.

[handrous]

I, for one, find data mapper simply baffling. I look at it and can't even comprehend why someone might want to do things that way.

Granted, I'm not fond of ORMs in general, but I at least understand the appeal of the active record pattern.