[AuthorizedCust]

> Could you imagine a news report about how the much touted vaccine efficacy of 95% didn't really pan out?

It didn’t pan out because of Delta, a way more infectious variant that became common well after the 95% figure was determined.

And it’s fully accurate to say that despite Delta, the vaccines are effective at preventing severe disease, hospitalization, and death. I think that’s a very good thing!

[orang2tang]

Anyone who took a biology class and paid attention could have told you that an efficacy-killing variant was an inevitability. Hell, even tinfoil hat Alex Jones said the same thing, and was for that specific instance, vindicated entirely. The top virologists didn't just "not take this into account", they willfully withheld this truth of how viruses operate in order to push a flakey, quickly-deteriorating product into people's arms.

So that "95%" figure was a lie to begin with, because those who touted it knew exactly what was going to happen. Viruses evade, and any non-sterilizing vaccine will be evaded by a virus. This is how you get delta, this is how you get omicron (which, by the way, was first found in fully vaccinated individuals and likely created through this evolutionary pressure).

Thanks

[allturtles]

> Anyone who took a biology class and paid attention could have told you that an efficacy-killing variant was an inevitability

On what basis? It's proved impossible so far to make a strongly efficacious flu vaccine because of constantly shifting variants. But on the other hand, there are many examples of successful vaccines that have never had an efficacy-killing variant emerge (polio, smallpox, chicken pox). How would anyone who has taken a biology class know a priori whether COVID-19 would be a flu or a polio?

[orang2tang]

Those vaccines are/were sterilizing, meaning the vaccinated person cannot carry or spread the illness after vaccination. Covid-19 Vaccines are non-sterilizing and only lessen-symptoms. As we can clearly see, vaccinated individuals still spread the virus. Not only that, but vaccinated individuals are an added evolutionary pressure for the virus, which causes the emergence of vaccine-evading variants. This means new variants can bubble up within vaccinated individuals, like we've seen with Omicron (and most likely the case for Delta as well).

Thanks!

[ufo]

This cannot be used as an argument against vaccination though. The same thing happens if the population has a high percentage of people who got sick with covid, except that in that case there is a much higher death toll.

[allturtles]

It's not that simple. The Salk polio vaccine did not prevent infection/transmission, but remained highly effective at preventing disease.

The initial studies on vaccine efficacy were designed to study efficacy at preventing serious illness, not transmission. So it was not known at the time how effective the vaccines would be on that dimension. To answer these questions requires novel research, it is not settled, freshmen biology knowledge.

[peter422]

If virologists weren't talking about it, how did you learn about it? Do you know enough about virology (or immunology as this would be) that I should listen to you over them?

If the vaccines don't work, why do people in the real world die much, much less often from covid once they are vaccinated?

If you are so sure an immune-evading variant will emerge, why hasn’t one? (There is no evidence at all that omicron evades the vaccines).

[orang2tang]

You shouldn't listen and believe anyone solely on the basis of their person. Many "scientists" or "experts" that you might believe in have financial ties and liabilities / political liabilities that prevent them from utilizing their expertise to full capacity. The world, money, and politics naturally suppress truth. The government told you the vaccines would stop the spread, limit deaths, and bring us back to "normal". Have you seen the numbers? Have you seen the quarantine camps? Upwards of 50% of COVID cases in some countries are among the vaccinated. Not mentioning vaccine injuries / deaths which the "experts" have told us are rare, but are bleeding more and more into each person's living reality.

Vaccine evasion is happening, and it doesn't matter whether it's delta or omicron. Would Pfizer pay for a study that proves their vaccines are worthless? Would Fauci, who hands down government money in the form of grants, give a grant for a study that would demolish the pharma companies that he has his money tied to?

The vaccines obviously have SOME efficacy, but just enough to make a product that sells. If someone sold you a new car, and didn't tell you it would break down 6 months down the road, wouldn't you be angry? They polished the car just enough for you to buy, without telling you what lurked in the shadows the entire time.

Virologists knew the roll-out of a non-sterilizing vaccine would end in the scenario we currently have. Period.

[peter422]

And the people peddling misinformation have no financial benefit? They don’t want you to subscribe to their patreon or their newsletter? Watch their YouTube videos?

Also the reason Pfizer or other people pay for studies that may disprove their drugs is because they actually don’t know whether the drugs work or not! They are paying to find out. Studies fail all the time. You’ve picked one of the most successful studies and treatments of all time to show the system is rigged. Look at all the ones that didn’t work. Why doesn’t Merck, the largest pharma company, have a vaccine? If it’s so easy to fabricate the data, why didn’t they? Why didn’t their virologists lie? Is Merck the only honest pharma company?

[rdedev]

Delta was first detected on india where at that time there was barely any vaccination coverage. And nobody knows from where omicron originated. You claim it could be leaky vaccines but it could have easily been from an immune compromised individual. Do you have any sources for the claim it was first found in a vaccinated individual ? I couldn't find any online

[wavefunction]

The 95% efficacy claim was the result of a scientific study of the efficacy of the vaccine against COVID infection. It was definitely not a lie unless you are an insane person with an outrageous definition of what a "lie" is.

[mikem170]

Or did they just not run the trials long enough to detect the efficacy dropping?