[kelleyk]

There are a number of points I'd like to disagree with, but to start:

- $150,000 is much less than a top-flight engineer like the one you're describing might make; it's not out of the realm of possibility for what an engineer with a good pedigree might make his first year out of school, if he went to work for a big company.

- The engineer went to school for four/five/six years and then went to work. The doctor who earns $300-400k went through a four-year university degree, four years of medical school, and a residency or fellowship before he started earning money. Some specialists, like neurosurgeons, take at least 11 years after getting their undergraduate degree before they really "get their wings." Not only are their then-substantial salaries offset by the huge delay in getting those salaries (residents make, what, $35k?) but they also have to pay for things like malpractice insurance, which can be in the six-figure range.

[randomdata]

> The doctor who earns $300-400k went through a four-year university degree, four years of medical school, and a residency or fellowship before he started earning money.

The market doesn't care about what you have done to get to where you are. If you spent the better part of a decade to acquire a Ph.D, you are not entitled to earn more money waiting tables at the local restaurant.

The upper bounds of earning is only limited by the value provided by the work. A good doctor or lawyer can provide a lot of value (health and freedom are, to most people, the most important things in life) and they are usually in short supply, thus they can command the high rates.

If programming jobs top out at $150,000, it means that either there is no shortage of people to do the job, or that it is simply no value in having someone do the work for more. In the latter case, if true, means that programming really isn't that important.

[wes-exp]

Yes, but the market does care about long schooling when it is a requirement to practice the profession. That's why it drives up wages in Medicine and Law.

[noarchy]

It only cares a little bit in some professions, such as humanities professors. They almost certainly went to school for longer than the lawyer did, but make far less. So the market value in this case is closely related to the work that is being done.

[wes-exp]

I agree with what you're saying. I was just trying to point out that strict education requirements (e.g. state regulation of the profession) do influence wages within the profession. Parent made a point about PhD waiters being paid the same as non-PhD waiters. But that is only true because restaurants have no requirement to employ advanced degree holders. By contrast, in Law and Medicine, you are legally required to have that education. The pay difference there is huge: a lawyer with a JD makes much more than lawyer without a JD. Because you can't even be a lawyer without a JD (under most state law).

My point is about the relative pay within a profession, rather than a profession relative to other professions.

[randomdata]

The market still doesn't care. The requirements just create an artificial shortage of workers, hence driving their earnings towards the value ceiling.

It is said there is a real shortage of programmers, so programmer wages will also be moving towards the value ceiling; which appears to be $150,000 (though I think there is room for debate there).

[bignoggins]

150K right out of school? I've never heard of anyone making that much in the valley, maybe 100K tops.

[timcederman]

I've heard $130k for top students is not uncommon.

[timcederman]

Downvoting me doesn't change the fact that I've seen offers for top CS Stanford grads for $120k for undergrad and $130k for master's, and that was a few years ago.

[apetresc]

It's definitely not outside of the realm of possibility. I know several people at that level right out of university (undergrad)

[anonymoushn]

How did they manage that? Is there some esoteric qualification that raises their value by 50-100% over other fresh graduates, or are they working at some company that happens to pay 50-100% more than Google and Facebook for fresh grads?

[mendocino]

Salary? Sure. But if you include bonuses and other compensation that doesn't seem too far fetched for Google, Facebook, Apple and the like...

[anonymoushn]

What's "Other compensation?" I don't think bonuses usually total $50K at these companies.

[nostrademons]

Bonuses + stock options + RSUs + perks can easily total $50K. Sometimes more.