[tn123]

I (Nils) was the maintainer of it for many years at the point already, and I was genuinely considering to let it die for quite a while. I was furious at what mozilla did to the loyal and active extension community and especially on how they did it - essentially by decree without community interaction at all. I was part of the mozilla volunteer army, not just with DownThemAll! and a few other more minor extensions, but I also had been on the team reviewing add-on submissions - I think I reviewed something like 2000-2500 individual submissions including updates in the end - and contributed a few minor bits to Firefox itself. The carelessness of how mozilla approached this large chunk of their community, after declaring their "1 million mozillians" goal not too long before, was mindblowing to me.

I eventually decided not to let it die... DownThemAll! had been a big part of my life, and while I recognized that I had to dumb down the feature set, I saw a way to at least make the core stuff work, maybe. I am glad I tried it even though it required a considerable amount of time to fully rewrite this thing.

The net result of mozilla's move was that they killed a large number of useful extensions entirely, while the survivors then usually became available for Chrome as well thanks to the mostly shared API - DownThemAll! is available for Chrome as well right now - giving users even less incentive to stay with Firefox. Oh well.

[anoncow]

Mozilla’s self-sabotaging actions made it seem to me that it was Google’s money talking. That it was a Google funded plan to kill everything that made Firefox great. Really enjoyed Firefox’s heydays and DTA. You guys were a part of saving the internet from IE.

[pcwalton]

I don't know where this conspiracy theory keeps coming from, but as someone who was there it's definitely untrue. Apply Hanlon's razor.

If Googlers could mind-control Mozilla employees, they wouldn't be sabotaging the browser. They'd be getting Mozilla developers to rubber-stamp their W3C proposals so they could look good on performance reviews.

[tn123]

I agree, it's untrue. In my opinion, most of the problems Firefox has stem from mismanagement and utter lack of vision.

This has a lot to do with mozilla losing their leaders and rock star devs at a rapid pace in the last 10 years. Some golden-parachuted out to the FAANGs, others just shrugged seeing the Mitchell Baker Club got more and more influential in a bad way and looked for less toxic places to work, and of course Eich prominently got cancelled for being against gay marriage and his departure rippled through the entire community. I was subscribed to planet.mozilla and there was a constant stream of "it's been fun, I am moving on" blog posts by names I immediately recognized.

The Code of Conduct situation caused a minor exodus especially in the volunteer community, especially outside of the US. A lot of rather important people, who were the ones building the local communities, just had enough with mozilla corp leadership unilaterally pushing stuff on them without soliciting any feedback first. mozilla was supposed to be this community of equals and Corp dictating more and more things really did not sit well with a lot of folks. Some outright (and sometimes rather publicly) left, others just dialed back their volunteer time a lot. This left especially the Western European communities in shambles.

The WebExtensions switch caused a lot of extension developers (who often were also volunteering in different areas of mozilla) to move on.

The loss of extensions, themes and customization options made a lot of the power users very unhappy. And those power users were exactly the kind of people who kept telling friends and family to use Firefox, driving Firefox adoption. While they often kept using Firefox themselves, they also quite often stopped advocating for Firefox in their circles.

All of this put together, mozilla losing leadership, volunteer, power user and dev mindshare at such a rapid pace then translated directly into a loss of market share.

Major failures such as FirefoxOS and BrowserID furthermore have been very demoralizing, making mozilla leaders very cautious, to the point where you had very little innovation going on from the top down. These failed projects - especially FirefoxOS - furthermore took away a lot of developers from the core product, leaving Firefox in a place where for years they had to play catch up with Chrome.

Things like Rust and servo where went more of a bottom-up direction, with bright engineers pushing it, not so much the leadership. And then these things were the first ones on the cutting block last year.

Google only "helped" in so far that they kept mozilla busy playing catch up, making the situation worse by a ton of (experimental) features and new specs that Firefox then had to implement, thus taking developers from other areas that needed improvement. I think most of the time it wasn't Google's intention to fuck with mozilla tho, it just happened to be the outcome.

[Xamayon]

I felt the same way about how they killed off the old extensions. It took a lot of work to rewrite my (much smaller) Image Search Options extension, and lots of once key features had to be removed... I tried to work with Mozilla to get a couple minor changes made to enable some of the missing features, but that went nowhere fast. The new extension works, but it's a shadow of its former self. Although I did also port it to chrome (why not, right?) I wound up not publishing the full version. For better or worse, I still feel Firefox is the best browser. Its a small measure, but if my extension has helped keep even a few users, I count that as a win.

[m4rtink]

The mobile Firefox situation is even bigger mess - there used to be a mozikka maintained Firefox build based on older Firefox cidebase that supported quite many Firefox extensions. Then last summer Mozilla decided to update the codebase and rewrite the GUI on Android. End result ? A hand picked list of essential extensions (Ublock Origin basically and little else) that are available that hardly gets ever extended.

You can add arbitrary exebsions to the android Firefix nightly build, but it involves a lot of unnecessary steps, such as custom extension list creation, id passing and other bullshit.

End result is that the best bet for using extensions on Android is actually Chrome extensions & the Yandex browser of all things, which will just install anything from the Chrome web store (and it often will even work).

Oh how low we have gone...

[tn123]

>I tried to work with Mozilla to get a couple minor changes made to enable some of the missing features, but that went nowhere fast.

Yeah, unless you actually write the code, there is no way. And writing code for the mozilla code base can be quite intimidating with their mix of C++ and js and XPCOM and not-XPCOM and webidl, etc. I once submitted a patch (unrelated to my extensions) that bounced from the who-is-who of mozilla rockstar devs at the time, and nobody wanted to really even look it because it was changing something so deep within the XPCOM-Javascript bridge and nobody really remembered how it even worked. I finally got my r+ from some brave soul who just said "I don't really know the code it touches either, but somebody has to do the review".

Even if you do the work, it can be an uphill battle to get code in, especially if you're trying to add new features and not just fix existing bugs.

I spoke to people within mozilla back in the day - I was part of the community after all and knew a lot of folks - and they weren't exactly happy, but weren't in a position to make things better, either.

DownThemAll! was big enough that they eventually "officially" reached out and ask me what I need, and then essentially said they couldn't really do any of it, "sorry" and they know "that sucks" (refreshingly honest, at least, but I wasn't talking to upper management but a developer-turned-developer-relations). The person who contacted me, one could tell, was given a mission to appease developers by showing mozilla cared, but wasn't actually provided any resources to really help or support people. All that person could do was to apologize and suggest to read the docs and read the docs on how to propose and implement new APIs - but at the time I had already proposed some new APIs that in my opinion would not just have benefited DownThemAll! but all kinds of add-ons dealing with downloads, and was struck down as "not generally useful to a lot of add-ons, sorry, we do not want to maintain such an API" already.

What I said almost 5 years ago still is true in that regard: they tried to a certain degree to accommodate some of the really popular add-ons, and with some success too, and the smaller add-ons were left in the dust. Not because of ill-will of mozilla, but simply because they lacked the resources to do anything more.