[crispyambulance]

> ...what an absolute train wreck...

I am sure they can be, but there are many accounts of talented people who initially bombed these things in a big embarrassing way, NOT because they lack ability, but because they never practiced for the test and didn't know what to expect (yes it happens).

This can happen to folks who learned on the job until they outgrew their job and decided to leave. They suddenly find themselves doing an "obstacle course" technical interview gauntlet that focuses on things that they just haven't had to think about for a long time (or ever). I believe talented enough folks can get through it if they can focus and study for a while (and accept the humiliation of failing big at first). It's not an infinity of subject matter, nor is it rocket science. I think if someone loves the work enough they can get themselves through it.

[b20000]

exactly this. and practicing for a few days is not enough. if someone who is experienced and can write software needs to spend months training for this, the interviews are broken.

but, i disagree with the solution you suggest. the only solution is to refuse and instead of wasting 3 months training with no guarantees, build a product instead and sell it.

[bradlys]

> but, i disagree with the solution you suggest. the only solution is to refuse and instead of wasting 3 months training with no guarantees, build a product instead and sell it.

Because being a software engineer means running your own business… right.

Just like surgeons should start their own hospital before getting hired. Makes total sense…

[b20000]

surgeons are not dealing with this problem. they get their degree, go through some mandatory on the job training, then get hired. nobody ever asks them later on to do some "surgeon leetcode" to prove they can do their job.

[pedrosorio]

Hopefully:

- clearly incompetent surgeons never graduate

- any surgeon who can’t do the equivalent of basic “surgeon leetcode” would be painfully obvious to their colleagues on the job and would struggle to continue employment as a surgeon

[cloverich]

Getting that degree and the mandatory training is FAR more work than a few months of leet code grinding. The leet code thing really really sucks. But it is light years easier than and less tedious than the hoops you need to jump through to become a physician, let alone a surgeon. A more comparable comparison would be if literally every programming job required that you passed multiple algorithm tests, some of which took years to study for, before you could even apply.

[crispyambulance]

> instead of wasting 3 months training with no guarantees, build a product instead and sell it.

I totally sympathize with your sentiments, but building a product and selling it ALSO has NO guarantees.

These folks that "learned on the job" often were hired into completely different roles from SWE but ended up doing it anyway and they're not making anything close to ~300K FAANG money. So, it's not THAT much of a stretch to blow a good number of months grinding leetcode if a job upgrade is a possibility.

Ultimately, it's a matter of finding the right place. Often that means using your professional network and getting referrals. If the gauntlet can be bypassed through connections, that's a good thing for everyone.

[b20000]

after building a product, you will have generated IP that you own. after doing leetcode for a few months, you have gained nothing.