[robomartin]

> Python is such a joy to write and such a nightmare to set up, package and distribute.

Here's my simple-minded metric on when this problem can be called "solved":

Get a VPS from GoDaddy.

Deploy your Django app as easily as you can deploy a PHP app, say, Wordpress.

I have written about this before. I love Django. And yet I think that they have done a huge disservice with the development server and DB configuration out of the box. Even for a simple application, going from developing on your desktop to deploying the same application on, as an example, GoDaddy, is in a range between nightmare and impossible. I have personally given up multiple times and just said "Fuck it! Just use WP" even when I really, truly wanted to stay in the Python/Django ecosystem.

Try it. Develop a simple photo album application. Get a VPS from GoDaddy and deploy it.

No Heroku et. al., are not solutions. They are indicative of the problem.

[selfhoster11]

I 100% agree. WordPress is the gold standard for ease of deployment. I specifically picked WordPress over other solutions because I knew the website will need maintenance without my help, and WP is simple enough for that.

[notatoad]

if you can use docker, that solves pretty much all the python packaging mess and makes deploying your challenge of deploying random python application to a random VPS pretty simple.

i'm not saying that python packaging isn't a mess. but it can be largely mitigated.

[robomartin]

As someone else said, Docker introduces yet another level of crazy to having to deploy a Python/Django app. I've looked into and used all of these technologies. We have developed internal "How To" documents on how to deploy different types of apps into a variety of environments. Reading through the Python/Django "How To" is a sobering experience.

This coming from someone who would truly like to use Python/Django exclusively. I hate, hate, hate telling people to just use WP or go a different route. I do not enjoy touching PHP. And yet...

[selfhoster11]

Docker takes away some problems and creates other, smaller problems. It also results in more complexity. That complexity is a problem.

I can teach a slightly technical person to deploy WordPress on a shared host with a pre-installed shared LAMP stack. I cannot do this with Docker, not to to the extent it's sustainable without ongoing help from me.

[riekus]

Sorry, but GoDaddy is a disgrace, and your comment makes no sense at all, you are comparing WP with Django. And instead of recommending VPS as a solution, you recommend the worst party offering these services?

GoDaddy should burn in hell for their shady shit.

[robomartin]

GoDaddy is a disgrace? It's shady shit?

C'mon, get some perspective.

I have been using GoDaddy for, well, I forget how long, maybe two decades. I have run websites for multiple companies from their servers. I can't remember a single issue. Not one. Even hosting and managing email. Frankly, I don't know what you are talking about.

I have also used Linode, AWS, Dreamhost, Rackspace and a bunch of others for different kinds of work. Not sure where the hatred for GoDaddy comes from.

I also know a bunch of people using GoDaddy servers. I think people repeat shit just because they think they sound "cool" and yet have no clue what they are talking about. Also, GoDaddy support, on the rare occasions they are needed, has always been top notch. So, yeah, no clue what you are talking about.

[selfhoster11]

GoDaddy is shady and I would not recommend it ever, but they are a good representative of the target market - something people pick despite the shadiness and inflexibility, because they require zero technical competency to get something up and running.