[michalf6]

Anti-consumer behaviour. Multiple hardware design faults in macbooks. Actively working against repair, against software freedom, against the user (see recent CSAM fiasco). Non-removable storage. Preference of thin&light vs upgradeability/cooling.

I wouldn't mind that as I'm not their customer, but all the crap they introduce gets mindlessly copied by all their competition.

[michalf6]

Adding to that, I'm afraid of the world moving away from the PC as a standard. Through a lucky set of circumstances, we were able to enjoy a relatively open and universal compatibility standard of computers for the last several decades.

I'm afraid of the computing world fragmenting again into several walled gardens in the likes of Amiga/Atari of old, nothing being compatible with each other, unable to run code not signed by the manufacturer.

The danger should IMO be obvious, but I watch in terror as my friends happily buy into the M1.

[can16358p]

The real problem is that there is no competition.

Not a fan of Apple here but I use (and admittedly like) their products: I develop apps and iOS is solid on the app landscape, currently we don't even care about Android versions of our apps in almost any project that we use because most people who are "serious" about their apps are on iPhones and iPads. In addition, even though I have the hacker mindset of many out here, at the end of the day I need something reliable and good-looking, and well supported, which Apple has and others don't.

I don't like Apple's user-hostile behavior and would happily love to see some competition. For me:

Apple is bad, Microsoft/Google is worse. So Apple is relatively good.

[katbyte]

PC like desktops are in no danger of going anywhere, there will always be a huge gamer and hobbyist market for them.

[sircastor]

Seeing that, it seems like this is likely cyclical.

We’ll have 20 years of siloed hardware, and then some competitors figure out a way to get a foot in the door, or signed-only systems will become distasteful to consumers and Companies will revert, interoperability will become the norm again.

There are always barriers in computing and society will respond to it.

[wheybags]

You dismiss 20 years of darkness like it's nothing...

[emteycz]

PC-compatible hardware and software is not going anywhere...

[5e92cb50239222b]

Until everyone stops buying it and it becomes a premium thing which the little man like myself simply cannot afford.

[katbyte]

PC like desktops are in _no_ danger of going anywhere. There will always been a huge gamer and hobbies market for them.

Laptops maybe, but the framework laptop is exactly what you want, seems pretty decent, and has a decent chance of taking off.

[tentacleuno]

> Preference of thin&light vs upgradeability/cooling.

I recently watched something[0] about the Macbook cooling (Intel, at least) and you seem to be right.

[0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlOPPuNv4Ec&t=0

[randomopining]

That's the premium you pay for the best.

[gremIin]

What is with this knee-jerk defense of Apple every time someone suggests holding them to a higher consumer standard?

You can sell good products while still embracing open technologies.

[thinkingemote]

It's protection of one's investment. One doesn't just buy a laptop from Apple but one invests in all the devices, apps, ecosystem and brand. It's why past apple users express so much hurt when the company crosses a line. To leave or even to criticise hurts psychologicaly and financially. Thus it is logical to protect ones investment and defend the brand on social media.

This extends to many brands of course for example AWS or anything where time or the person is invested but it's most easily noticeable with Apple on HN.

[spacebear]

Yes. We live in a world where our only real freedom is our purchasing decisions. I think that leads to people making brands, TV shows, video games, etc. a big enough part of their identity that criticism of that thing feels like criticism of them personally.

[jkepler]

How is a laptop an investment? Its a tool one uses, but it doesn't generate a return, properly speaking. Or would you say that all tools are investments?

[randomopining]

You pay $800 and you get your value. The market obviously decided that the value provided is good enough, since their sales are good. Just because you value certain things doesn't mean the collective does.

[godDLL]

Just because some sliver (OK, large sliver) of their consumer base is satisfied with this shit doesn't mean that they didn't live a sizeable amount of people stranded for both hardware and software options. Because they did.

I used to be able to slam an MBP down on the woodworking table, open it up and start typing. Now there is no slamming, because they flimsy. No typing near dust, because they get stuck in the keyboard. Every app is a single window, so you can't chat with two people at once. Everything is in the cloud, so you wait on your very fast computer to do networking all the f.in time (even opening Finder). The UI has lost so much of it's legibility that I don't know what I'm looking at half the time anymore. Active window? Maybe not? What does that label say? Why is this a modal? Where is the "don't ask again items" preference pane?

We have parted ways, I think. I'm not riding with them anymore.

[mwint]

Flimsy? MacBooks? Are we in different universes?

Keyboard is/was a valid concern. But flimsy, I’m not seeing.

Pretty sure I could murder someone with my M1 MacBook Air, clean it, and then write code.

[godDLL]

Or poke a hole in the screen by leaving a single speck of sand on the keyboard before closing the lid.

There used to be a thick glass panel in front of it, but no more.

[smoldesu]

Macbooks are easily the flimsiest devices I own if not for the display alone. I've dropped a Thinkpad out of a moving vehicle, and it booted up like nothing happened. My Macbook tumbled 2 feet onto a concrete floor and now the $600 topcase is destroyed...

[anothernewdude]

This is the market being insane though, because they pay a premium because of branding.

[5e92cb50239222b]

Which is especially hilarious in low-income countries like mine. The cheapest latest iPhone (I don't remember what the current number is) costs about 3 median monthly incomes. Most of the population cannot afford one, so what do you do? get a loan and pay in monthly installments until the next one comes out, of course.

This isn't a rare occurrence, I'd say ⅓ of my acquaintances do this. The power of marketing at its finest.

[godDLL]

It used to be, circa 2009-2015, for me and mine.

But not so anymore. Yes you pay. Yes the price is fair for what's on offer. No, it's not quality, and not the general direction I'm interested in, at all. Not in hardware, not in software.

[michalf6]

I have a different definition of "best".