[Ginden]

This post should be titled "what ORMs have taught me: world is black and white, if you use ORM, you can't use SQL".

Are ORMs leaky abstraction? Yes. All non-trivial abstractions are leaky.

Can you write 95% of code in ORM and drop to raw SQL for 5%? Yes.

[rowanG077]

This. In the vast, vast majority of cases I prefer writing my stuff with LINQ. The ease of use and type safety is just brilliant. And still for more complex queries or queries that don't perform well enough I still reach for SQL. The point of ORMs is not to obsolete SQL.

[tester756]

>All non-trivial abstractions, to some degree, are leaky.

https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2002/11/11/the-law-of-leaky-a...

[everybodyknows]

From your link, a remarkable irony:

>The SQL language is meant to abstract away the procedural steps that are needed to query a database

Leaky abstractions, all the way down?

[klysm]

I would definitely say SQL is leaky. Certainly not fully declarative. I think it’s important to have escape hatches though - if you have to be leaky you may as well be intentional about it.