[shaggyfrog]

Facebook is a massively evil company, a true net-negative to life on earth, a destroyer of personal privacy, responsible for facilitating genocides, constantly lying to its users, the most egregious example of how corruptive a monopolistic corporation can be on a society at a global level.

If this recruiter is to believed -- and I wouldn't believe a goddamn word of any of it -- there are all these poor, principled people who really truly want to "make Facebook better" but dangnabit they just don't have critical mass yet.

Bullshit. All of it.

This is a carefully calculated response, like all of Facebook's responses (PR or otherwise), to make you drop your guard and stop using your critical thinking faculties. It's a siren song, with promises of six figures and early retirement.

Listen... if you're at Facebook, you've personally made a decision that you'd rather collect your paycheque than stop contributing to the beast that surrounds you. You're fine with the pervasive corruption and rampant disinformation and hypocrisy because you're making bank. Don't be shy. Own it. Say it with a full chest. At least it would be genuine.

But don't lie to yourself, or your coworkers, or anyone outside the company, and say you're trying to "make Facebook better". It can't be made "better" in its current form. It will never be better. It needs to be dismantled. It needs to be put on trial. It needs to be bled dry.

[KaiserPro]

> This is a carefully calculated response, like all of Facebook's responses (PR or otherwise)

if facebook had good PR, it would be google.

You are putting far too much faith in the power of zuckerberg.

> It can't be made "better" in its current form. It will never be better.

so you're arguing for the banning of all social media?

[acwan93]

>Listen... if you're at Facebook, you've personally made a decision that you'd rather collect your paycheque than stop contributing to the beast that surrounds you. You're fine with the pervasive corruption and rampant disinformation and hypocrisy because you're making bank. Don't be shy. Own it. Say it with a full chest. At least it would be genuine.

So true. I would never want to work for Facebook, but I’ve always wanted to reply back to their persistent recruiters with an obscene salary expectation just to see if they’ll consider it.

[drstewart]

I'd say the same goes for scum that work(ed) for other evil companies like EA, too. Don't you agree?

[aaomidi]

EA hasn't really been tearing the fabric of our society apart, the comparison isn't really there. They're just a run-of-the-mill psychopathic company.

[throwawaylinux]

> Facebook is a massively evil company,

Companies for the most part aren't evil or good, they're a tool. And they behave like a gas that fills the container they are in.

If not facebook, some other company would make money in some way you would find similarly objectionable.

> a true net-negative to life on earth,

Facebook has really facilitated family, friend, community and volunteer groups I'm involved with to connect and communicate easily. Social media in general has been great at elevating the voice (at least the collective voice) of the common people to something vaguely competitive with the ruling class and their dinosaur media / propaganda corporations too. For a couple of examples.

There are also downsides of facebook and social media in general, but I don't know that it's so clearly been a net negative.

> a destroyer of personal privacy,

Law enforcement and intelligence agencies already destroyed personal privacy before facebook.

> responsible for facilitating genocides,

Language and writing is also responsible for facilitating every atrocity committed in history but they have been overwhelming net positives to humanity. The same is and will be true of computers and mobile phones from now on.

It's a great go-to for the emotional argument and outrage, but anything can be misused.

> constantly lying to its users,

Like virtually all politicians, and every corporation does (or would if they thought it might help them in any way).

I'm not giving facebook a pass on its behavior, I just don't think it's useful to be fixated on them as though they are the source of evil and problems with society, as opposed to an unsurprising product of the environment created by society.

Facebook's lies and actions did not result in the invasion of Iraq that destroyed a sovereign country, resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people, and took trillions of dollars, for example. That was the doing of the corrupt corporate-political system in the country. The vaunted New York Times was one of the mouthpieces beating the drums for war, no less. Just as they did in the lead up to American involvement in Vietnam. Just as the media corporations did in the calls for the wars and interventions in Syria and Libya. And on and on. So much for disinformation, eh? Yes, internet and social media corporations have or will be pulled into that system (as traditional media companies were) and made to facilitate this kind of thing but again I see it as a symptom rather than a cause. And not really facebook specific.

> the most egregious example of how corruptive a monopolistic corporation can be on a society at a global level.

I don't really think it is at all. The entire military industry are basically arms dealers and war profiteers. Banking industry was complicit in housing collapse that destroyed many people's assets. Pharmaceutical companies literally create epidemics of drug addiction. Tobacco companies similarly. Fossil fuel companies tried to bury climate science and lobby against externalities created by their product, not to mention the way war follows them around like they're a horseman of the apocalypse. Clothing companies (and many others) infamously use child labor, slave labor. Mining and extraction companies have pretty commonly taken full advantage of high levels of corruption present in developing countries. The list just goes on and on. I'm willing to hear you out, but it's a pretty damn high bar that your evidence for facebook being the worst-of-the-worst is going to have to overcome here.

I'm not going to defend facebook the company or social media in general here, because I don't know enough in depth about either subject to really offer a worthwhile opinion on it (and I don't work for them, hold their shares, or have any association with them). I just want to give a bit of balance and perspective to the fashionable "facebook is the devil" opinion.

[aaomidi]

> Listen... if you're at Facebook, you've personally made a decision that you'd rather collect your paycheque than stop contributing to the beast that surrounds you. You're fine with the pervasive corruption and rampant disinformation and hypocrisy because you're making bank. Don't be shy. Own it. Say it with a full chest. At least it would be genuine.

I think it's also on us to stop holding facebook at such a high level.

People are proud to have facebook on their resume, maybe they shouldn't be. Maybe facebook should be seen as an embarrassment. Maybe facebook should be something you want to hide from some employers because they're going to judge you for accepting a job from them. (Exceptions for h1b, first job, etc apply)

It's kinda how if you tell me you were a cop I'm going to immediately see you as a power hungry and abusive thorn in society. The burden of proof is on you to...show me that's not true. Some decisions have consequences I suppose.

[lelanthran]

> I think it's also on us to stop holding facebook at such a high level.

> People are proud to have facebook on their resume, maybe they shouldn't be. Maybe facebook should be seen as an embarrassment. Maybe facebook should be something you want to hide from some employers because they're going to judge you for accepting a job from them. (Exceptions for h1b, first job, etc apply)

> It's kinda how if you tell me you were a cop I'm going to immediately see you as a power hungry and abusive thorn in society. The burden of proof is on you to...show me that's not true. Some decisions have consequences I suppose.

You appear to be in some sort of bubble, where people are ashamed for their engineering work. This is never going to be true; anyone who puts something on their CV that indicates a high level of technical competence is going to be in demand no matter how much you wish otherwise.

Same with cops - you appear to be believe that law enforcement is forced upon an unwilling population. This is also not true: people prefer to live in places with an active and working law enforcement. If there isn't one the populace, by clear and almost unanimous majority, creates one.

You are free to move to places that don't have law enforcement officers. However it seems that the rest of the world (outside of your bubble) doesn't care for your ideals. I can't blame them.

While we're on the subject of judging people, what do you think people think of you when you say you want to ostracise law enforcement officers?

[hxhjfjcjf]

> It's kinda how if you tell me you were a cop I'm going to immediately see you as a power hungry and abusive thorn in society.

Why do you assume that? How is this any different than assuming any generalization/stereotype about a group of people is true until proven otherwise?

[aaomidi]

The difference is being a cop was a choice. Being brown isn't.

[throwawaylinux]

How is that a meaningful difference? If being "brown" was a choice would that make it reasonable basis to discriminate? How about "acting black"?

[aaomidi]

Lol nope not touching this with a 10 ft pole.

[throwawaylinux]

Hell of a way to go through life.