[porb121]

everyone points to a "hunger response" or something similar with non nutritive sweeteners and then these effects don't materialize in actual outcomes: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/obr.13020

"Grouping by nature of comparator revealed that NNS vs placebo/no intervention and NNS vs water produced no effect."

so like, there's a food craving, and then ???? you don't gain weight. who cares! maybe you eat more in the next meal, and then it's not clear this persists into a real caloric surplus.

[foxyv]

This isn't novel research. A lot of it has to do with an effect where our bodies will secrete insulin in response to a sweet taste or even just something in our mouth. Insulin will decrease release of fat energy and turn on exclusive sugar metabolism. Without the expected influx of glucose, blood sugar will drop, making us hungry and stressed as we attempt to come back into homeostasis.

Some people underestimate the power of food cravings. The amount of willpower needed to overcome cravings as a result of starvation can be monumental. Some people have never experienced starvation level hunger in the first world. Some people experience it every day by choice.

Your brain will re-wire itself to think of nothing BUT food and how to acquire it. You notice colors associated with foods. Smell becomes heightened. I once smelled what the neighbor was cooking two doors down and felt an overwhelming urge to knock on their door. Commercials for food are endless. One time on a walk, a white-tailed deer walked by and I had the feeling of a NEED to run it down and kill it with my teeth.

Real hunger, experienced by people every day, is almost at the level of psychosis. Trying to hold a job, raise kids, keep a house, and have a relationship while starving yourself to not be fat is nearly impossible as it is. Artificial sweeteners aren't going to MAKE you eat. But they will make you even more miserable.

[porb121]

oh, interesting. can you link an rct or meta analysis describing literally any of these effects coming from artificial sweeteners.

[foxyv]

Most focus is on incretin hormones. (peptides from your gut) These are triggered by the taste of food which subsequently trigger insulin release. What is interesting is that these can even be triggered by smells.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19221011/#:~:text=The%20incr....

https://www.nature.com/articles/ejcn2014208.pdf?origin=ppub

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25782410/

[porb121]

it's strange i ctrl-f'd "psychosis" and "killing deer with teeth" in those papers and got 0 results

[brodouevencode]

Adipose storage is much more sophisticated than just simple excess calories.

[JasonFruit]

In practice, "Do I have excess calories?" is an excellent approximation for "Am I gaining weight?"

[manmal]

The problem with this is that „excess calories“ is a moving target. Insulin and thyroid hormone levels have a say in that, too.

[porb121]

so how come nobody gets fatter drinking nns's vs placebo or water or no intervention

[renbrom446]

>replacing sugar with NNS leads to weight reduction, particularly in participants with overweight/obesity under an unrestricted diet

NPR repeats the same old wives tales like you would hear from the guy next to you in line at Dunkin' Donuts but in a soothing posh accent to make you think you are an intellectual.