[gruez]

>>The current climate is caused by a failure of government to step in and intervene, not by the industry caring about profit above all else.

>No, it's both. Full stop.

disagree. it's the job of government to add legislation. not having rules, then acting surprised when things don't go the way you want is asinine. if you want people to act in a particular way, spell it out. Don't act like it's implied and be outraged when people don't abide by your imaginary rules.

[jjulius]

It can be legal to be an asshole, but you're still an asshole. It may be legal to act in an unethical manner, but you're still acting unethically.

We absolutely are in the "current climate" because the industry cared about profit above all else, because they could.

[gruez]

This presumes there's an universal definition of asshole/unethical that everyone agrees on. You might think paying workers minimum wage is asshole/unethical, so you pay above it even though it's above market rate. Other business owners disagree and undercut you, causing you to be driven out of business. You think they're assholes and fume in your head about how evil they are, but they think nothing's wrong and you're just a bad businessman. Is it fair to denounce them for the way their acted, because their morals don't match up with yours?

[boston_clone]

People doing things worse is rarely a valid justification for not doing things better. What a weird approach to ethics in this thread.

Are our moral goals no longer about improving and setting a higher bar for how we conduct ourselves? Have we succumbed to material wants and ego at the cost of decency? Goodness gracious.

[gruez]

I don't think you'll find much objections to doing good, but but where do you stop? Say the minimum wage is $10 and you decide to pay your workers $15. You still get flak from people who want you to pay even higher (see: amazon getting flak despite paying above market/minimum wage). Do you just turn your business into a non-profit? After all, any profit means there's money that could be spent doing good.

[jjulius]

They can be a better businessman and still be an asshole. The two are not mutually exclusive.

[colinmhayes]

There will always be people who are willing to be assholes for money. Yea they're an asshole, but they're not actually making things worse since there are plenty of people ready to replace them.

[coliveira]

You must be joking, because people who believe that greed is good are exactly the same ones who believe the government should not be imposing rules and everything should be left for the markets to decide.

[gruez]

How is this relevant? Me subscribing to "greed is good" doesn't also automatically subscribe to "there shouldn't be any government intervention".