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by kodah 1721 days ago
I'm a lead software engineer on a polyglot team that requires broad knowledge and in-depth knowledge on distributed computing.

If I can give any advice to engineering managers when someone quits: If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all. The last three people that have left my team are people I know personally. Hearing an engineering manager berate and degrade someone who I have been through incidents, significant refactors, mentoring, debates, and late night delivery with is a new experience entirely. The first time it happened I had to talk the engineering manager down from making someone a non-rehire, the second time I didn't even bother. My judgement of them was fully passed on to the company and the leaders above this engineering manager that gave them accolades and excuses.

Most of the time when I leave a team it's because something either in the management chain like a process or a manager themselves failed me on such a deep level that the hope that gets me out of my bed that says, "We'll do something great today!" has departed me. This post reads to me like that is inevitable, but it is not. If you listen, ask questions without assumptions or judgements, and act as an enabler instead of a Lord or Lady then you'll strike long careers out of engineers. They may leave out of better bonuses or incentives, but they at least won't leave because of you, and one takes a substantial more amount enticing than the other.

6 comments

Also worth remembering: Managers directly influence the performance of developers. If you don't have anything nice to say, it's not necessarily your fault, but you should ask the departing dev if they feel you got them what they needed.
I just realized how much higher my performance was under managers who thought I was talented, and how little I ever completed when my managers questioned my mental abilities.
The other part is dont over praise them. Last year we had a guy leave and the boss spent 10 minutes talking about how he was the best dev he's ever seen and wondering how we'll cope without him. Geez, he wasn't that good, I'm sure we'll be OK but now I'm wondering why the boss doesn't like us.
You can praise someone without putting anyone down.
If someone is the best ever, that means you are worse. In that sense, this specific praise is putting everyone else down.
"We'll really miss his excellent work. He lived up to the team's high standards."
Yeah, this. "We'll really miss your excellent work that lived up to our team's high standards" is a much different message than "Your work was the best that I've ever seen, and it's going to be hard for us who are left to step up and fill your shoes".

The latter doesn't explicitly put anyone down specifically, but it does heavily imply....

They don't have to say anything, the feeling is enough.
People should leave. Engineers do better learning new systems - learning from new people. You should leave every three years. I don't cry when an engineer leaves - they should!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epoch%C3%A9

has this word ever cropped up in the workplace/culture?

+1 to you because I hadn't come across this concept before and it seems like a useful thing to have in the back of my mind.
Could you perhaps give a layman’s tl;dr? The article looks like it requires a lot of background knowledge.
I think in many cases, it's that outsiders get hired in at a higher salary while doing seemingly the same job. I could understand how that would make all existing team members feel like they also need to switch jobs to get a raise.

Especially, it seems, because software engineers are quite shy about negotiating in general. I know several people who are grossly underpaid in my opinion, but they prefer to avoid the discomfort of disagreeing with their manager. Still, I believe that's a bad long-term strategy for the manager. It makes them extremely easy to hire away if I can offer them our usual salary and it's double of what they currently earn.

Who cares for drama. Berate if you want. My service is my brain as a CPU not human drama service.
As someone who leaves every two years: don't take his words for gospel. Do whatever works for you.

It is absolutely possible to grow in the same company. Never worked for me but I've seen it many times.

Staying with the same company for too long might not be the most efficient way to make more money, though